Interview with Santiago Herrarte
Introduction
On November 22nd, 2022, I interviewed my father Santiago Herrarte Hernandez. My mother is from the United States and traveled to Guatemala after college, where she met my father. I was then born in Guatemala City, however thanks to my mother I had automatic US citizenship upon birth. However, my father was born, raised, and lived his entire life in Guatemala City. Therefore, when we moved to the United States in 2014, he had to undergo the entire naturalization process. I have spoken with my father about various topics, but never about what the process was like and how the move impacted him. For this reason, I decided that this would be the perfect opportunity to get to know more about my father and what the process was like for him and how it has shaped the person he is today.
My father was born in the capital of Guatemala, Guatemala City, and he lived there for over three decades. He studied Medicine in college and worked as a Physician in Guatemala for 20 years. Never did he think that he would be living in the United States or would one day become a citizen of the United States. His passion was always helping the people in Guatemala without access to healthcare. However, many push factors in Guatemala forced him to reconsider his priorities. Working as a physician, he was kidnapped and mugged on more than one occasion. Additionally, many other factors made the country an unstable place for his family to grow and live. Therefore, after careful consideration and conversation with his wife, he decided that Guatemala could no longer be his or his family’s home. He began the naturalization process in the year 2013. There were various pull factors that attracted him to the United States, these factors included safety, opportunities, and growth. Ultimately, the United States was the best option for not only him, but his family.
Methodology
The interview was conducted in-person on November 23rd, 2022, at our household. I came up with questions that would drive this interview and also allow me to get a better understanding of what the process was like and what his experience has been so far. Prior to the interview, the questions were shown to my father so he could get an idea of what the conversation would be like and get prepared to answer some of the questions. Moreover, doing this would allow him to inform me if he did not feel comfortable answering any of those questions. However, he found all of the questions to be interesting and did not refuse to answer any of them.
Analysis
One of the first questions I asked my father about was his childhood. My father’s first statement was that he had “the most wonderful childhood”. He grew up in the capital of Guatemala City with his parents and siblings. However, at the time a civil war had broken out that lasted 36 years, it started in 1960 and finished in 1996. My father was born in 1974, therefore the country was at war for the majority of his upbringing. He then explained how the war was initially fought in the rural areas, but then moved on to the city. At one point, he mentioned how he was at school one day when he heard several blasts and explosions, then the principal ran into my fathers classroom and told them to take cover and stay down. This story was eye opening to me, because I cannot imagine raising a family or living in a country where explosions become a daily phenomenon. This war certainly was a push factor for many Guatemalan citizens who were forced to leave the country or face the atrocities of the war. Moreover, then my father detailed how the war then affected his family in a very hard way. His uncle and aunt were both killed in the war, both abducted by the Guatemalan military and murdered. I imagined that after this occurrence, and several other push factors, my father and his family would be more inclined to immigrate to another country. However, I was very mistaken, my father and his family had no interest in leaving, because to them Guatemala was their home. This reminded me of the statistic that we reviewed over class, which detailed how only 3.6% of the world population immigrates to other countries, which is a very small number compared to what one would imagine.
Then my father spoke about how he worked as a physician in Guatemala for many years. He explained how a physician is treated differently in Guatemala compared to the US. In Guatemala, the pay for a physician is mediocre and their work truly is more of a charity, since they invest a lot of time and money, but don’t get much financial gain out of it. However, he explained how the reason why he went into medicine was due to the fascination he had about medicine from a young age, and also after seeing the conditions of where his people lived. He compared the living conditions for these individuals equal to the ones of the middle ages. This also reminded me of the recent immigration patterns towards the United States, where a large amount of immigrants are coming from areas like Guatemala. After hearing the living conditions of this country being compared to the middle ages, I can understand why so many individuals from Guatemala are leaving their country.
We then discussed what the move was like for him and his parents. Hearing how much leaving his parents and family behind hurt my father was very impactful. My father was always close to his parents and siblings, hence it was not easy for him to have to leave everything behind. However, my father then talked about how despite having a falling out with his parents when he informed them about his decision, they decided to visit him in the US. This meant everything to him, I could see his eyes brighten up when he spoke about their visit. Listening to my father talk about this made me also think about the millions out there who have made that same sacrifice. Moving to another country is not easy, but it is often necessary to ensure a better future for one and their family. Additionally, to make matters worse, my fathers brother and mother both had health complications a couple of years after moving to the United States, and he was not able to be there for them. These events really changed his perspective towards life as he mentioned in the conversation, they made him value time with others, because a lot can change in a short period of time. Then, my father explained why he had to make all these sacrifices, including leaving his family and career behind.
Guatemala is not a safe country. My father mentioned how he was abducted on one occasion and mugged at gunpoint on several other occasions. He stated how these events factored in when my mother and him decided to move to the United States. All my father could think of was how he did not want his children growing up in that kind of environment. An environment which he claimed made him act “psycho”, because he just never knew if his family, we, would make it home safely, which is why he was always texting and calling making sure we had arrived at our destination in one piece. Listening to him talk about his behavior truly makes me understand why he could not keep living that way, and why he needed to make sacrifices and immigrate.
I also asked my father what his immigration process looked like and he explained how it was a lot of planning. He spent years getting the documents prepared and paying fees, nonetheless he claims he was fortunate, because it was easy for him. Since my father had been married to my mother for over a decade, the process was pretty simple, it just took time waiting for documents to get filed. He described his process as a “dream”, because it was too easy, and he knows that this process is not easy, millions of people would do anything for this, however he was very fortunate. He also talked about one of his friends who immigrated to the United States before him. He described his process as very “hard”, because he came with nothing more than the clothes he was wearing. My father also mentioned that if he had to go through the process his friend had gone through, he never would have left Guatemala. This further highlights the reason why only 3% of the world population immigrate, because it is not an easy process or transition.
Conclusion
Ultimately, this interview was very meaningful to me, because I had moved at a young age and did not know all of the work and reasons why I had left my birth country. All I remember is my mother telling me we are moving to another country that will be my new home and that I don’t have to worry about anything other than going with them. My parents did everything, the paperwork, selling the house, packing my belongings. Nonetheless, what hurt me the most was seeing my father talk about the family and profession he left behind. He often clashed with his parents, therefore I had no idea that it hurt him that much to leave them behind. However, seeing him choke up and tear up when he talked about how he could no longer see his parents or work as a physician opened my eyes to everything he sacrificed for my sister and I to have a safe environment and better future. This interview highlighted some reasons why people immigrate to the United States and how it is not easy to leave everything behind. It also illustrated how every immigration story is different. Some people are fortunate and can have an “easy” naturalization process, while many others cannot say the same. I feel very grateful for his sacrifices and I live everyday knowing I must do my best to not let my fathers sacrifices be in vain.
Interview
Nicholas: [00:00:00] I’m here today with Santiago Hernandez and I’ll be asking him questions about his immigration process to the United States. First off, my first question is what was growing up like in Guatemala?
Santiago: Well, like you say, my name is Santiago I, and what I remember of my country when I was a child is I have the most wonderful childhood.
I remember having so much good time with my mom, dad, and my siblings, but at the time I was growing in Guatemala. I was born in 1968. Guatemala was already in a civil war. We were living in the city in the capital of Guatemala. So, we the don’t really realize about the civil water because that was most happening in the rural area.
We have some type of experience of what was going on [00:01:00] because my dad, he is a civil engineer. Most of his work was in the rural area. So when we go to see his job, we, we will always ask him that why there are so many soldiers in here and whether stopping us in the car and, but we never really, uh, saw violence.
That wasn’t until I was a teenager that they wanna move on to the cities. So then we actually see what was going on in my poor country. I remember that one day I was receiving classes in the school and suddenly we hear a huge boom, all the glasses of the window were like moving and we all watch our faces like what’s going?
and then the booms continue and we hear the, the sounds of the machine guns. Suddenly the [00:02:00] director of the school enter, he was pale and just tell us everybody on the floor, uh, there are some violence outside. I think that they, the guerillas that were the one that were trying to fight against the government. They were fighting the army like two block from the school.
And then we finally realized, my God, we are in the war. Then unfortunately, I lost one aunt and an uncle. They were kidnapped by the government and they, my aunt, they, we find it like three weeks after they kidnapped. and, but my uncle, he was disappeared. We never ever find him. So I was still young. I was like 13 years old.
But I saw the suffering of my mom, my dad, my grandmother, all the family. And [00:03:00] when they were trying to find them, I saw their scared, scared faces of what’s what we are gonna do? Maybe something against the family. And so we. We still have our normal life, but it was some scary, scary moments in there.
Nicholas: How did you feel when all that was happening?
Were you scared? Were you, uh, in fear?
Santiago: Until they kidnapped my family members, I actually realized, oh my God, this is, this is not like people have said., , like the fact that everybody was telling that the government was trying to protect us from the bad guys and the other, the bad guys were communist and, and this and that. But it was not true. And because my aunt and my uncle, they were just hard work people.
So then I finally [00:04:00] tried to put more attention to what was going on and. I realized that there wasn’t really a good or bad, the government was protecting the interest of the rich people and the poor people are, were really, really tired of being practically slaves. So I was like, this is gonna be bad when I enter college.
I went to the public college. That was really the nest for revolution. Revolution in there. So then I get in contact with most of the people that were like maybe not fighting against the government, but were the one that were telling that the rich people don’t pay the fair salary tool. They were one, they practically are slaves and we need to do [00:05:00] something.
It was so scary.
Nicholas: And do you think, uh, the war and seeing everything that happened to your family impacted your decision to pursue medicine?
Santiago: Since I was a little kid, I always like medicine. I really don’t know why, but I, when I talk now with my wife, she said that I’m the widow that already knew what was going to be when I was adult.
I really, I knew that, that that was my passion and still is my passion, but yes, you are right. When I went to the rural areas, because in the college that I studied, we have to do a lot of community work in the rural, poor areas, and I saw how these people live and was like, Jesus, this is inhumane. You just see this type of picture when you won’t go to the movie and.
Like pictures [00:06:00] of the middle age or France in the French Revolution and you’re like, these poor people really don’t have anything. They just born and they are lucky if they surpassed the five years old. So along then I, not only, I want the passion of the medicine, but also. . I want to help my people. That’s the funny thing in my country, really, when you study medicine in my country is different than in the United States.
Over there. You do it most for the social work. You don’t look rich millionaire physicians walking in the street. If you get really rich because your family was already rich, most of the physicians, they are doing most of. The work is social work, trying to help people.
Nicholas: And what was one of the main reasons for moving to the United States?
Was it [00:07:00] something to do with the war, or what was one of the things that made you move to the United States?
Santiago: Yeah, it, when the Civil War finally was over, that was 1997, if I’m not wrong, they finally signed the piece between. Communist people that were trying to take power on the government. But unfortunately, I think that in all Latin American countries, the army is not really to help people.
They are the most corrupt and bloodiest people that you can find. But that time they begin to with, because they were without a job, there was no more money. United States sanctioned Guatemala because of the human atrocity the army was committing. [00:08:00] So they stop any type of helping or sending money to Guatemala.
So, the army, the chief army, not the soldiers. The soldiers were just kids, but like the upper heads of the army. I will say like the diversified, the business. So they begin the business of kidnapping and stealing cars, and then in the eighties begin the, the horrible problem of the drug dealings. They really do partnership with the drug lords.
we get out from a civil war to a violence of the drug dealing. Not that my country use the drug, but unfortunately because of the geographic position is it really worked good for transporting the drug to the north. So the number one [00:09:00] reason was the violence that was experiencing in my country. I have really.
Three, bad, bad experiences. I was kidnapped once and they stole my car two other times, and that was really, really scared for me. And I saw my kid were growing and I thought with my wife, and my wife told me, you know, the kids are growing. They’re finally gonna say, I wanna go to the movie dad. I wanna go with my friends.
And I was like, oh, no. . I don’t want that in my conscious. And I really knew a couple of family members and friend that lost their kids in in. They were just done doing anything. They just get assaulted in the car. They want to steal your cell phone. And the kids said, no, I’m not giving you my phone. And they shoot them.
So that was the main reason [00:10:00] we decide to move.
Nicholas: And what do you think was the most difficult part about leaving your country?
Santiago: my family, my mom, my dad, my brothers, uh, I really don’t have too many friends. Just a couple. But it’s different is maybe you don’t see your friends on your family members every single day, but you know they are there.
You just need to drive 10, 15 minutes and you can see your mom and dad or you just make a phone call and say to you, let’s meet in a restaurant and we can be there. And now I’m too far.
Nicholas: And what was it like when you first arrived? What was your, what were your thoughts and how this us was what? What were your initial thoughts of everything here?
Santiago: Oh my God. That was really, I think the second scariest thing I have ever made in my life. The first one were the kidnapping on the robbery of my [00:11:00] car. . Just the idea of coming to a new country that doesn’t speak my language and my age. Also, people that in my country decide to go to us are like half my age.
I know that I was really old to begin all this process, but mm, I have to do it for my kids.
Nicholas: What do you currently miss the most of your country? If you could have something right now, what would it be?
Santiago: I think two things, my family and my career. That was my passion.
Nicholas: and what are you currently doing here in the United States?
Santiago: Right now I’m working at VCU, doing something related with medicine. I, unfortunately, I try to apply to the, to the boards. I pass the boards and, but the last one, I have some difficulty doing [00:12:00] it. Then, uh, they, I realize that I have to do the whole residency program and most of the hospitals don’t receive people my age.
for doing residences. They want younger people. So right now I’m just trying to see what else I can do. That’s, I think that’s my main problem. My, I never believed that that was, that was going to be a burden in my life, knowing what I wanna do with my life. That was medicine and now is a burden because I don’t find anything else.
Always return back to, to my career.
Nicholas: And what do you find strength in this difficult times like what do you usually do when to find strength? Like I understand it’s hard not being able to do what you wanted to do for a living. So how do you find strength in that?
Santiago: My family seeing my really, [00:13:00] eh, these last years living in Guatemala was like being a psycho, always worried about where is my wife, where is my family.
I was always sending text messages, trying to call them. I always tell my wife, when you’re home, please text me that you are home. Don’t get out of the house. Please don’t stop to the supermarket. We are going to go all together. And that was really not living. So, the main reason I, do everything I have to do, I have to do it is because of my family.
my two babies, well, they’re not babies anymore, and my wife.
Nicholas: And how do you think migrating to the United States has changed you? Has it changed for the better? Has it opened your eyes to something else? Or what is being in the United States have done to you? Yeah,
Santiago: I think that in my country we always have the idea of that people that [00:14:00] doesn’t have any chance.
getting more from life. They were the one that migrate to North America, that people that are really, really poor and they don’t have anything else to lose. They want, they want moving here, but actually I think a lot of people would like to come here because of the violence Also, I realize, and I think I get.
I have also become more patriotic now that I’m not in my country. And the other thing it will be, I learn two basic things. One is stop running in your life, trying to get everything fast and just pursuing goals. because life is for enjoying it, and [00:15:00] the second one will be, don’t take anything for granted that, especially with people, don’t think that they’re going to be with you forever.
I say that because last year I lost my mom and my brother and being so far was really. So. Hmm.
Nicholas: And, as time has passed, now that you’ve been here for, well over five years, maybe nine years here,
Santiago: eh, we just have eight years and four months,
Nicholas: how has it, how has your experience, changed from, from when you first arrived here?
Santiago: Yeah. I told my kid that my story of a migrant is not the story of all the migrants, really. I marry a US citizen. So, I was able to do all my paperwork [00:16:00] since my, when we were in Guatemala, everything was so smooth and easy that I was like, if I want to see signs from heaven, I think they are giving me all the signs to leave my country.
And we were also, Economically, we were preparing everything so we can make this move that we can do the movement to here. So, I always, always emphasize to my kids our story of being migrants is not just the story of every migrant that just come with the clothes they have, and the stuff they put on. We were able to come a little bit more prepared.
This makes our life easier.
Nicholas: And how long did these preparations take? Like when did you decide it was time for you to move and how did you break the news to your kids? [00:17:00]
Santiago: Actually, we prepared to move two years before finally we moved, my kids were really young, so that was probably, I don’t know, was a mistake from my wife and me, we never ever discussed the issue with them, so we just mentioned them that we’re going to move, but that was it. We never asked for their opinion of what they think. I think the first year for them was really, really hard because they grew with their cousins. We all live in the same lot, so they always grew with their uncle, cousins, and grandfather, at least my family in my family side. So that first year for them was really hard, but they were young, and I think they really, really now have been used to living [00:18:00] here. I don’t think they will go back for any reason. So, I think it was a good decision.
Nicholas: And how do you think your family’s adapted?
Well, how do you think your family adapted and how do you think you’re doing with the whole transition?
Santiago: Moving my family here or my family that I left family here? I think that, like I mentioned, the first year was really hard. Even though they know English, because my wife, like I mentioned, is from United States, so she always talked to them in English.
They were studying over there in an international school, so most of the time they, only speak English in there, but it is different when you come in here and actually nobody outside spoke Spanish. I think the first year was hard for them because they were also lonely. We don’t have anybody else in here, just mom, dad, and my two kids, but after [00:19:00] that they, I think they begin to, feel more comfortable in here right now.
I think they’re really, really fine living in here, at least now. We no longer have to do the Psycho thing that we used to do in my country, they are really happy. They don’t have to do it. Like for example, before we moved, when we decided to go to the supermarket in the car, we said, okay, hide your cellular phone. Or they say, can I take this? And I say No, no, no. Leave it at home. Don’t wear anything fancy and hide everything else behind the seat. So, if for any reason somebody tried to assault us in the car, they don’t see your phone. So that part, that psycho life that you have to have in that, in my poor country, they are really happy they don’t have to do anymore. They don’t have to, they’re in here.
Nicholas: And how do you think your family in Guatemala, adjusted and felt about you moving to the United States?
Santiago: Oh, I think for [00:20:00] my mom and my dad it was the worst hit I can ever give to them. I think. They understand my whole situation, but they were like, I don’t know. I really hurt them; I think.
Nicholas: Do you think with time they realized that it was the best decision for your wellbeing or?
Santiago: I think so. I think so. But like I told you, when, that first month, that when, the time was approaching that we have to leave, they were like, the first month they were really angry. They were really like trying to, every time I talked to them, they were like, oh no, because your decision is you want to go, so what can we do and all this.
But then like three or, six month before the day we left, they totally changed 180 degrees. They were saying. [00:21:00] I love you. Don’t go there, stay with us. And they were really, really good with me.
Nicholas: And were you able to visit them back after moving to United States or did you not visit them?
Santiago: After we left, went two times.
They, they always tell us if you move to United States, don’t even think to come back to Guatemala the first year. It’s so hard to get used to the new country that if you go back to your country the first year, you’re going to be like, I want to come back. I don’t wanna be there. So, we tried to stay there, but I had a beautiful, beautiful, unexpected visit from my mom and dad.
They came to visit me that first year we were here. We have such a wonderful time. Unfortunately, they cut their trip [00:22:00] early because my sister was sick, so they have to go back to Guatemala. But we have the most amazing two weeks ever, and I have all those memories. Then we went visiting them. We stayed like three or four weeks with them.
That was also an amazing trip. My kids have so much fun with them. We always travel by Christmas and seeing my country in Christmas is beautiful and then I have to travel when she got sick. That wasn’t such a good trip.
Nicholas: And what were your thoughts when you went back to Guatemala? Like what were your thoughts about being back in your home nation? Were there any changes to the country or?
Santiago: it’s the same? It’s basically the same thing is still a [00:23:00] really dangerous place. When I’m traveling, I’m like a tourist. I go only to the beautiful places, hotels, and. It’s beautiful to travel, but then when you, when you go there, like right now that I went to surprise my dad in his birthday, that was going to be his first birthday without my mom and my brother, and I actually go with him to his work and going in and out.
It was like, oh my God, this is the same thing. I left. It hasn’t changed, you know?
Nicholas: Would you ever consider going, moving back there, or have you decided to stay here for good?
Santiago: I think that we never going to leave our kids ever, ever. But I think that with my wife, we have that crazy idea of we for sure will travel back, only [00:24:00] me and her stay a couple of months in the beautiful places my country has, and then come back to the US.
Nicholas: and what are your most, favorite things that you’ve had in the United States? What are things, places, foods, activities that you’ve enjoyed the most while being here?
Santiago: I, the most thing I, I like in here is the, first of all, the security. That’s not even an issue. You don’t have to even think about lock the doors or, or every time you get out always watch your back because somebody can be approaching you to hurt you at any time. Also, the, the, the streets, the, all the infrastructure they have in here, no traffic. Oh, this is amazing. Yeah. They have their issues. They have their issues. But it’s a beautiful place and I’m really thankful of, [00:25:00] uh, what the United States has given to me and to my family.
Nicholas: what’s something you could, if you could change something from the United States, what would it be? What’s something you would like to change?
Santiago: I think maybe because this last year’s, couple of years, because of political reasons I was, I never in my country we saw that division, but because my country is more of a social system.
In my country, there are only two, two social classes. Well, really three, the archie Millionaire people that live like they are in heaven. And then 70% of the population that is poor, but poor, like they live of $1 a day and a little, little small middle. In here. I think that there’s so much polarization, but [00:26:00] not about money, but about races, I think, and I, that’s what really, I find strange that people in here say the white, this one, the black, that one, the Asian, that one, they don’t even mention their names.
Like, over there in my country, you say the name, not if he is. Hispanic or his white, or he’s Indian or his, you just call from their names. I think that that’s the only thing I have realized, their polarization there.
Nicholas: And what have your experiences with race been in the United States? Had they, been bad?
Santiago: Sorry, the what?
Nicholas: Your experiences with race like, with racism and all of that.
Santiago: I think that talking about race is like playing with. You don’t play with fire. My grandmother used to say, because if you play with fire sooner or later, you’re going to get burned. And I think that there is [00:27:00] too much polarization this last years.
And there is no union or identity that everything, everybody is part of the country. So I think that if you don’t fix that type of problem, this could get worse. So I, I hope they, they find that they are more eager to find the good thing and the common things everybody else have and not so good to find the things that make us different.
Nicholas: what, what do you think has been your biggest challenge being in the United States? Has it been something politically, or do you think work wise or? What has been your biggest challenge being living here?
Santiago: With my career, the problem is that when you don’t have a career is easier to find any type of job.
It’s not that [00:28:00] other jobs are not as rewarding or they are inferior jobs, but when you have that passion that I have for medicine, doing other things that are in the medical field, make me feel frustrated. But right now, like I told you, I’m doing something related in medicine and we will see what the future said.
Nicholas: And I know we’ve been talking about what your experience has been like moving here, uh, what your career experience is like. But now I want to know, um, what is something that you’re very proud of that you’ve accomplished while being?
Santiago: I think that I’m raising with my wife, two wonderful kids, and that’s the first thing that make me feel so proud. I always tell them at the end of the day, [00:29:00] everybody learns how to read and write. Everybody learns how to get a career or profession, but not everybody have good feelings or try to help other people.
I think that that’s the most important thing that and make us humans and I’m really proud of my kids.
Nicholas: And what is something that you hope to accomplish in the future in this new country?
Santiago: I haven’t really abandoned my idea of trying to do something in the medical field and, but right now my goal is trying to help my two kids that now they are beginning their journey in during college and universities.
So right now, all our energy and effort. Our job is to help them pursue that goal and that they [00:30:00] find, just like me, that job that is a passion. Like also, my grandmother used to say that if you find really what make you happy in life, you are never gonna work a single day of your life. Um, when she told me that, I was like, I don’t get it.
But then when I finally finished college, I was like, I love this, my career. For me, it’s not a job. Its what I like to do.
Nicholas: And do you think you’ll, um, continue pursuing school or maybe get a certification to be able to continue working in the medical field?
Santiago: I’m, I’m, I’m thinking about that, but like I told you, right now, my priority are my kids.
So that’s also, eh, unfortunately, that’s a lot of money too. So, I think I already got my chance and [00:31:00] now my priority are my two kids. And,
Nicholas: If somebody was planning on moving to the United States, what piece of advice would you give them or what would you tell them to expect for moving to, to this new country?
Santiago: Like I told you, my story of a migrant is totally different to the 99.9% of the average migrant that come to my country here. I will tell them first that
make it the legal. or go to the formal or legal passive because if not, you are in disadvantage for everything. You cannot find a job, you don’t have that stability of a job. Everybody will take advantage of you because of course you don’t have any type of legal paper that that can help you in here trying to [00:32:00] find a job.
So I will try first, try to make all legal papers so you can move legally in here and also to see what really think, what the reason, why are you living? What is the reason? Like in my case, violence was everywhere. So, it is not like I could say, okay, then just going to move to other place inside of my country that is safer because the whole country I, we will tell them that.
Nicholas: And, would you recommend people to come to the United States or would you not recommend this, , migration? I
Santiago: think that migration, it will be fine. When people are trying to, how can I explain you? When they are trying to pursue a. Upper degree in your [00:33:00] career or because in your country they don’t offer that type of studies, but when the main reason of your migration is violence and war, that’s a shame that nobody should leave their country because of violence or war.
That’s, that should never, ever, ever,
Nicholas: And do you think the situation in Guatemala will, um, improve in the coming years, or do you think, uh, it’ll just stagnate and stay the same?
Santiago: One time I was in, when, when I was working in the hospital, somebody showed me a picture in Facebook and the picture was an old guy with a paper in a one of the manifestation against the government and they said, and the paper said, [00:34:00], my father told me to be patient, the whole situation of this country is gonna change. Now I’m getting older and then I continue saying to now my kids, to be patient, the situation is gonna change unfortunately in my country. The change is just worse, so I don’t think so.
Nicholas: Yeah. What kind of change do you think the country needs to face in order to improve and potentially stop having people migrate to other countries and keep their people from migrating?
Santiago: Eh, before I came to United States, The European nation was helping Guatemala because of the corrupt system that we have.
It was really impossible to, to make some [00:35:00] changes because judges, the president, everybody that was in the politics were, are corrupt. So they tried to help us trying to, to put an institution over there that was going to help to try to. Find these people that are doing the bad things in my country, it works like for five years, and they were doing a lot of improvement.
But like I told you, my country is owned by 10, 12 families that are the archie millionaires and they’re the one that really put precedents in my country. And as long as, they don’t touch them. They don’t care who the presidents are. So I think it’s really difficult to try to change it. At the end. They, they get rid of that institution, eh, right now they are formally [00:36:00] persecuting the judges that tried to go against the rich people.
Most of the judges already flew the country and they came here to United States as asylum seekers because they knew they were gonna kill them. So we are back again like in the eighties. So, it’s like the same thing coming back again.
Nicholas: And have you had any other friends or relatives that have migrated the United States too or were you one of the first
Santiago: One in New York. And one of my friends came a couple of years before but his situation was different. He, he had a really hard time coming here. He, I think he went to live with his sister. His sister was already living here in Chicago, but he had a really, really hard time.
[00:37:00] He migrate only him like with only the clothes he was wearing, and that was really, really hard for him. Now he’s better. And now he says, I will never go back to Guatemala. But I think that he had really tough years when he just came here.
Nicholas: And if you had been in his position and, and moved the way he did instead of the fortunate way that you did, do you think you would’ve, continued or do you think you would have stayed?
Santiago: No, I will never come.
I came here just because my wife is a US citizen, and I can, I could do it the legal. if she was a Guatemalan. I think that I will do the same thing as any Guatemalan. You’ll get used to that make our little prayer every time that when we were kids, my mom always told us, before you leave the house, you have to say, [00:38:00] señor protejame y librame de todo mal. And it means, please God protect me. I don’t know. What is the, word for that, can you say it?
Nicholas: Uh, protect me from all
Santiago: Oh yes, protect me from all Evil. They always say you that when you leave home. And I finally ask her Why you say that? Because just in case that something bad is gonna happen to you, maybe you don’t have a chance to, say a prayer so this is to put your soul in peace.
That was the country I grew in. You had to make your prayer before you leave home because probably you are not gonna make it back. And probably you’re not gonna a chance to say, please God help me. But no, if my wife wasn’t from here, I would not have come.
Nicholas: And how do you think the rest of your family is doing Guatemala.
Do you think they’ve ever thought about moving to the USA or do you think they would never?
Santiago: I don’t think they ever consider [00:39:00] that? No, my dad, no, my dad, I remember when I was a kid, he did some churches for a religious group from here, from us, and I remember that the people from the church were talking to him and say, well, why don’t you go to with us to the USA, we can take you to United States and you can help us build.
The churches over there, I think was in Utah, so. I don’t know what type of religion they have. Probably Mormon. Mormons yeah. So my dad was like, mm, I don’t know. I, remember he discussed with my mom and my dad was like, my dad is really Guatemalan. He was like, I’m not leaving my country. I’m staying here.
So we stayed.
Nicholas: And do you think, his perspective of Guatemala has changed throughout the years, or do you think it’s the same?
Santiago: I think that most of the people that stay there is that [00:40:00] they are used to living like that, the way you live is like, you know that if you’re going to go to the street, you don’t put any fancy shirt, earrings, or chains, or you hide your phone.
You don’t go to certain areas at that time or you. You get used to living like that.
Nicholas: And did your family ever travel to the United States? Prior to you moving
Santiago: Oh yeah. We came with my dad to Disney in Florida like three times. He, and my mom used to travel. They went, I remember they went to Washington, also to Georgia, Florida.
They went a couple of times to Europe too.
Nicholas: and what has been your favorite state or place you’ve been to in the United States?
Santiago: Well, I always have been a fan of Mickey Mouse, so I always love to go [00:41:00] to Disney, but the place we’re living in here is amazing. It’s beautiful. It really is beautiful.
Nicholas: What made you want to move to Virginia out of all 50 states, what made you decide on Virginia?
Santiago: Yeah, my wife’s study at a college here in the Richmond area. So she’s from Washington DC. So when we were discussing the first time to come here, we were, that was the main question where we going? So, we saw Washington, that was a really expensive place to live, and I told her, well, we are not gonna be able to afford this safe place, and we are gonna go to live in a poor area of Washington, and in that case we better stay here.
I’d rather prefer to get mugged in Guatemala in Spanish than from another person speaking to me in English. So, we, she told me, I, I study in a college that is closer to Richmond and I think that’s [00:42:00] a good place to begin. She has the license that she’s a teacher, so her license only works in the state of Virginia, if not, if we have to move to another state, she will also have to do a type of test or something. So I told her, if we both don’t have a license, we are not going anywhere. So because she already had her license in here, that this was the, the perfect place to move.
Nicholas: And you, have you ever considered moving to another state? Or do you think your kids will ever travel to another state?
Santiago: State? Me, no. I think one move for me in my lifetime is more than enough. In my country, really, people don’t move. You stay where you are. Even where you live or in your job. I work in the same hospital for 16 years until I resigned. Because I had [00:43:00] to come here to the US and I live in the same place. In the same area my whole life.
So I think this was my second and last move. My kids, I don’t know. I don’t know where they finally decide to go, but we will see.
Nicholas: And how are you liking Virginia so far? Do you have a, like a house you’re planning on permanently staying at or do you think you’re going to be moving around Virginia?
Santiago: No. Uh, like I told you, I think we’re going to stay here. I love this place. We have the four seasons. I never ever saw snow just once when I come visit my wife, when we were dating, and I never saw fall the leaves turning brown. I never saw that. That’s really beautiful. So I think this place is nice. We have four [00:44:00] seasons when you are getting already bored of a climate it changes to the other season. So, so far, it’s a really good place.
Nicholas: What’s your favorite season?
Santiago: Fall.
Nicholas: How come?
Santiago: The colors, the weather turns more like in my country. No humidity. That’s beautiful.
Nicholas: Well, thank you very much for allowing me to interview you. I appreciate this.
Santiago: Okay. Thank you for having me.
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