From Across the Atlantic

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Joey: Hi, my name is Joey Yosco. And today I’m here with my uncle, who recently immigrated here to the United States. So if you want to introduce yourself, say your name, and where you’re

David: from. Yeah, hello, uh, this is David Wilson. Originally, I was from London. I was born in London, in the United Kingdom.

And, uh, I’ve been living in the U. S. since, uh, around 2000, so 23 years.

Joey: Uh, so how old were you when you decided to immigrate?

David: Well,initially, I, I wasn’t planning to immigrate. I was planning to like work over here on a temporary visa. But then, after meeting your aunt, I got married. And then thought that we were going to spend the rest of our lives here.

So it was sensible to, you know, become a U. S. citizen. Yeah. Um, so that was in about 2006 I started that process.

Joey: Okay. So How long would you say you lived in England for?

David: Well, I lived in England or since I was born in 1964 so what’s that 36 years? Until 2000 when I moved here, and then yeah,

Joey: so um you mentioned like working in the United States for a while,  So what was your job in England before you immigrated?

David: It was a similar, um, field, so I worked in the food industry, food manufacturing, and, uh, food distribution. So, I came over to the U. S. to launch a particular food product. I thought I might be here on a short term assignment, but I liked it here.

Joey: Um, yeah, so What was, like, the main driving force, I guess, was it your, like, decision just then, were you for work, or my aunt, or

David: No, itwas work initially, you know, and it’s about opportunity.

America is such a big country, you know, for the food company that I was, uh, responsible, it was, it was really about, like, making money. Yeah. And, uh, building the business and becoming financially secure. I was in my thirties. It was like a career move, but then, when I lived here, it was like, wow, this is a pretty good lifestyle.

Living in Manhattan, and traveling around the country, and the business was going well, and then I met your aunt. You know, we fell in love, got married, and it, you know, you get to the point where there’s, it’s a point of no return. Yeah,

Joey: everything’s like cohesive, it goes together, you know.

David: It seems really kind of straightforward now, looking back, but at the time, There’s, you know, a lot of influences, like people, family in, in England.

So it’s a little bit more complicated than the explanation, but that’s the basic story.

Joey: Okay. So,can you, like, describe the immigration process? Like, was it difficult, or?

David: Yeah, well, it’s not easy. No, it’s quite, quite, uh, bureaucratic and complicated. Uh, the first part was actually getting a green card. Um, so that was, um, that gave me the authorization to work legally over here.

And that was an application that I did with my company. Uh, that got me in the country and I was able to stay in the country for as long as I liked. Then I got married, uh, and then had to go through the immigration process to become a citizen. Uh, that started with finding a lawyer, she had to find a lawyer to complete the paperwork.

We were living in Connecticut at the time, uh, so we found a, a lawyer in the Connecticut state capital and submitted the paperwork. We had a lot of documentation to pull together to prove that we were a legitimate couple, you know, that we weren’t kind of faking the system. Yeah, there’s stories about that every year.

That’s right, yeah, people kind of like getting married for, under false pretenses. So we even had to. Uh, in our file, we had this immigration file that was like 10 inches thick. And we had, we had to put in things like, uh, wedding photography, photography of our families. We had to Show that we had, you know, um, when we got married, where we went on, uh, our honeymoon, uh, information about my job, about Renee’s job, that we were both kind of, uh, uh, financially secure.

Uh, then we had to start, I had to study about, um, um, there were certain questions they were going to ask me. Uh, so we had to do all of that preparation and it was all pulled together through an attorney and submitted. To the immigration service and it took a while it like it took probably more than a year

Joey: Yeah, sounds very extensive.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah serious business and then and then you go in for an interview You actually sit down with the immigration officer and they ask you a bunch of questions I think I think Renee was with me at the time. Your aunt was with me at the time and certainly the lawyer was with me and And the, and the office is basically trying to establish whether the application is, you know, credible, which obviously it was, uh, but it was kind of a little bit nerve wracking because you don’t want this to go wrong, otherwise your life kind of changes, and then, uh, and then a letter came through probably a month or so later saying that yes, you know, they It was approved I was going to become a citizen and then I had a, um, an appointment at the court where they actually granted me my citizenship along with a bunch of other people.

David: There’s nobody else from England. Yeah, I was going to ask you that. And then a judge basically tells the audience, you know, welcome to America, you’re a citizen. Away you go.

Joey: Was there like a monetary factor in there? I’ve heard stories where you have to pay a certain amount to become a citizen.

David: Well, yeah, there was.

You had to declare your savings and your salary, your job salary. Well, it’s basically to just demonstrate that, you know, that you, uh, You know, economically independent and that you weren’t going to kind of take from the Economy you were going to give and you know, I put it put forward an argument that I set up a company I was employing 20 people.

Yeah, you know I had to put an argument forward to say that You know, I was giving something to America, not just coming here to live off benefits.

Joey: So, a lot of immigrants, like, now, when they come into the United States, come from Latin America, and they speak Spanish. So, you come from England, so you already, like, know the language and such.

Joey: So, like, already knowing the language, you think that made the process a lot easier? Well,

David: it was the, like, the paperwork was in Spanish as well as English, I remember that. But you do have to do certain, there was, uh, like a test, uh, and you have to demonstrate a certain level of English. Obviously, that was straightforward for me.

David: But, you know, I can imagine if you came from, you know, Latin America, it would be more challenging. So, yeah, that, that is one of the criteria. Mom,

Joey: did you leave any, uh, family members back home?

David; Yes. Yeah, I did. I did. Uh, well, my parents were in England and, and, uh, uh, and other kind of aunts, uncles and aunts.

David: And, uh, you know, interestingly, I actually sponsored my mother with her citizenship. Oh, okay. That was a few years after I became a citizen because, you know, she wanted to move close to the family. Okay. Is, um, Freddie’s a citizen? Freddie’s not a citizen. Freddie’s a green card holder. Oh, okay, okay. Yeah, so, yeah, so my son from our first marriage, he, he, uh, was making lots of trips out here.

David: But basically, when he was a student, he came to your birthday. Yeah, yeah. When he had that big snake, he remembered that. And, uh, and then, you know, as he got older, I realized, well, it might be a good opportunity for him to get a green card. So He can come and go as he pleases and get a job over here if he wishes.

David: It’s nice to have the options, you know, not to be just tied to one particular country. More economic choice. Yeah.

Joey: I guess that answer kind of ties into my next question about like how you feel about having dual citizenship, dual citizenship and its benefits and such.

David: Well, actually, interesting you say that.I, in the eyes of the American, uh, um, government, I, I, I relinquish my citizenship to the UK.

Joey Yosco: Oh, really?

Yeah, so you have to basically say, you know, you swear that you relinquish your citizenship to the UK and you’re American. You know, so, I hold an American passport, I pay taxes. Wherever I travel in the world, if I moved to Australia, I’d still have to pay American taxes as a global tax citizen.

Now, from the UK, the UK does accept dual citizenship. So when I, I renewed my UK passport, and in the UK I said to them, Look, I reside in America, I’ve got an American passport, and they recognized dual citizenship. But the Americans don’t recognize dual citizenship, which is an interesting distinction. It doesn’t really make any difference.

You know, I’ve got two passports. I can live in both countries. You know, and Rene can live in both countries, and my kids can live in both countries. And that’s what’s important to me. Because you don’t really know. You know, I might want to go back to the UK, you know, sometime in the, in the future.

Joey: So, Renee and Olivia both have British citizenship?

David: No, uh, Renee, uh, Olivia does. So, when we lived back in the UK for a year, do you remember? Yeah. Back during COVID. Because you’ve actually got to be there for a period of time. In order to get a passport. Now, Olivia as a child, you know, a descendant, she was able to apply on the back of my passport. Now, Aunt Renee would have to go through a process for UK citizenship in the same way that I went through the process for US.

Yeah. So, and that’s, you gotta pay a lot, lot, legal fees, you gotta do this and that. And, you know, I don’t think that’s really going to be necessary.

Joey: Yeah, like the whole spiel.

David: Yeah, you know, it’s long, it’s a year. Same in the UK as it is in the US. And there are a lot of people that want to go to the UK, like they want to go to America.

Joey: So, you mentioned before that you liked it here when you first came here. So, your first impression of the States was a good one, I’m guessing, when you arrived.

David: I came as a tourist. I came here when I was 14. I came back when I was 15 and then 16, you know, I, I came back for a full year before I started college at 18.

David: So I had a good understanding of America. Excuse me, and I, I was motivated to live over here, but also I could see work opportunities that were much bigger than they were in the UK. So, uh, you know, I knew what I was getting into. It wasn’t as if I was like, you know, crossing the border into an unknown country.

Joey: Uh. Gotcha. Yeah. So, when you ended up coming here, did you end up furthering your education to, say, obtain a better job, or?

David: Yeah. Yeah. Good point, actually. I did. I did my undergraduate degree in England. You know, I got my, uh, Bachelor of Science. And then, uh, I did some work in England, and then I thought, well, I want to live in America long term.

Joey: Why not do a Master’s?

David: So, I went to the University of Dallas and did a Master’s of Business Administration. international business. And, uh, that was really good. I actually ended up going back to England and then coming back to the States. And that’s kind of been my life, like being in both places.

Joey: So do you, so when you go back and forth, how often do you go back and

David: Well, it’s, it’s varied over time.

David: When I was running that business that was UK based, I was trying to set up the operations over here, I was traveling sometimes twice a month. Ah, okay. It’s crazy. Yeah, that sounds hectic. Yeah, it was too much. But, but then, obviously, when I met, met, uh, Renee I slowed it down a bit and now I would say I’m going back four times a year to visit family, but also business reasons as well.

Joey: Okay.

Joey: Um, so what jobs did you work with while you were here in the US and what is your current job

David: currently? Okay. Well, when I first came out here and I was a student, I worked at the university as uh, an assistant to the dean. Oh, really? So it is like a research job. Then I did casual jobs, like I worked in, in supermarkets.

David: Uh, so I was interested in food and also, uh, restaurants. I was a waiter, actually, one of my top jobs was a door host . And uh, that was when I was living in Texas, doing, doing my MBA. Um. Yeah, but that wasn’t really kind of like a serious career. It was just like money that helped me get through college. Hmm.

David: Uh, but then I came back. Um, I did, I did a course actually in, uh, where was that? It was in Chicago at a business school there, Kellogg Business School. And, uh, I worked with, um, so, so there I was like learning more about the food industry in America. And I worked for Budweiser. Which was very cool.

Joey Yosco: Oh really?

David: I was like, I had a I had a sales rep’s job, went around the streets to the stores, uh, worked in the warehouse. And that, again, gave me exposure to what, like, the American culture was compared to the British. But then I came back, uh, and it was a, I was running, um, you know, the U. S. division of a food, of a bigger food company.

David: Uh, but it was a start up. So I started up the office, recruited people. Uh, but we’re selling natural and organic food products to retailers like Whole Foods, Trader Joe’s, uh, so I was meeting customers, I was arranging for the importation of the food, and the marketing and distribution around the state.

Joey: So would you say, um,those experiences, like, helped and benefited you and to where you are, like, now, like, your position, your career now?

David: Yeah, yeah, well, like, now,I’ve got my own company. It’s called Green Seed Group. Yeah. And we help, you know, it’s a consultancy business that helps other companies start up in America. You know, so I think what people value in me is You know, I did it myself. I started up from scratch. I came in as an immigrant, you know, and a lot of people that I meet now from Australia or New Zealand, Italy, uh, Sweden, Finland, the UK, they’re looking at Iceland, you know, the Icelandic yogurts, they meet me and they say, Oh, right, you know, David has been through an experience that, You know, they could kind of, uh, um, appreciate and, you know, my, my help to them is, you know, directly through the experience that I had.

David: So I developed a consultancy that really focuses on helping those sorts of international food businesses get a foothold in America. Gotcha.

Joey: That’s very interesting. So, uh, what got you so, like, interested into food and, like, food business

David: in general? Well, I think it was, it was something that was just like, you know, it’s like a natural interest, you know, when mother used to go, my mother, you know, uh, Nanny Beryl, used to go to the supermarket back in London, I actually quite, I was quite intrigued by it.

David: I know it sounds a bit weird, but I, I was like, push the trolley and look at the food brand and think, well, that’s interesting. Why are we choosing that over the other? So it started quite young. Then when I was in Texas, I worked in a supermarket, literally sacking groceries and also putting products on the shelves.

David: And whilst many people would find that really boring, I found it quite fascinating. Uh, so when I went back to England after doing my MBA, I looked at like banking, finance jobs, and I just, you know, I could see that it would be attractive, making lots of money and like being a big shot in the city. But, I also had a lot of jobs where I was looking at consumer products.

David: I found it much more interesting. And I worked for a cookie company, Keebler. Oh, there we go. Yeah, so I was like, it was just something naturally that I was, I was drawn to. And then when I got into the job, I realized it played to all my strengths. It was like a little bit creative. It’s teamwork. It was in, it had an international dimension.

David: It was like practical as well. It was, you know, designing the packaging and like developing new recipes. The stuff that I was interested in and quite coincidentally my sister also got involved in food So it must have been something that happened to it as a child As children that we just ended up in that field.

Joey: Yeah, that’s very it’s very interesting. She she works in wine

David: All right. Well, I hope her husband works in wine. Okay. Yeah, but she actually works at green seed now. Oh, really? Okay But she started off, she went down like, uh, more of the restaurant path. She worked as a chef in top restaurants in London. So she did a, uh, you know, chef training course in London, worked for restaurants, um, and then after doing a kind of a little bit of a career there, she came into Greenseed after, after raising a family.

David: The kids went off to college and then she Join me at green seed and she’s been working at green seed for 10 years now. Oh, yeah So she loves the food business in the same way that I do but her career path was slightly different Yeah,

Joey: so yeah guys, I guess just fell in love with food. Yeah You can find things and that’s why we’re here today, you know, yeah Today is Thanksgiving.

Joey: Yeah Um, so when you did end up coming here, you came, you came with Aunt Renee, right? You didn’t comealong?

David: No, I came alone. You did? Come along. Okay. I came alone. Uh, but, um, aunt Renee was involved in a similar field of work. I was on the food manufacturing Mm-Hmm. and distribution side, but she was in marketing, in public relations and her company was helping me, uh, you know, market my food brand in America. And, uh, through a friend of mine and Renee’s, we were introduced. So, but that was probably, like, two years into me being here.

Joey: Okay, so you guys met here, yourself?

David: Well, we actually met in London first. Oh, okay. Through the, through this, uh, marketing company. And then we met again in New York. Um, Renee came back after 9 11.Mm hmm. Uh, back in 2001. She returned, and I was here, and we were introduced through a mutual friend.

Joey: Gotcha. Alright. So, what do you think the most difficult part about leaving the UK was?

David; Well, friends and family, really. Yeah. You know, even like, um, holidays, like, you know, we don’t have Thanksgiving in the UK, but we have Christmas, and it’s really, you know, the moments where you’d like to be with family.

Now, obviously, we’re lucky enough that we’re able to go back, but it’s just not the same. You know, as, as, Like parents and uncles and aunts get older, it’s more difficult to all kind of get together. But, you know, you, you’re a part of my family now, so I’ve been able to enjoy it here. But it’s not quite the same as if we all lived in the same neighborhood.

But it’s no different than your mum’s family who are based down in, you know, the Maryland area. It’s tough for them to come back here. You know, but it’s just, it’s 3, 300 miles to London, so it’s a little tougher. But, um, but we’ve made a lot of effort, and Aunt Rene’s been able to do that over the years, going back and forth.

But, it’s expensive, and, you know, that’s, that’s kind of the toughest thing, is missing those moments of being together. Now, like, we can watch the same News, we can watch the big, you know, because the way in which media has changed, we can stay in touch with, you know, all the same TV shows, a lot of, uh, a lot of the cultures become quite similar, America and the UK, you know, so, yeah, so I don’t miss that at all, you know, I watch Premier League Soccer here, and it’s just the time difference, um, but it’s really friends and family.

Joey: Yeah, I’m guessing Freddie’s probably a big part of that. Sure. Yeah.

David: Yeah. Yeah, well, that’s been very difficult, you can see. You know, he, he, uh, I moved out here when he was three, three and then, you know, he’s been able to come out once or twice a year all the way through, um, and then when he was sort of at college, he’d come out for longer periods of time.

And then post college as well, but, you know, it’s been, um, You don’t have a life in both places, you have half a life. Yeah. You know, it’s not quite as, um, not as ideal as being in one place. Yeah, I get that for sure, it’d be hard. Yeah, yeah, it puts, it puts a certain strain, you know, you hear this a lot about people that are emigrating maybe with less, you know, less money, you know, than I started off with, that, you know, they really aren’t able to go back as frequently and it can cause, you know, major emotional trauma, you know, with the people that are here, you know, I don’t think we haven’t, uh, suffered in that way because we’ve been able to fly and we’ve always had a mobile phone or, you know, Being able to do video calls, technology’s really helped in the last decade, but, uh, it is still, you have the moments that are sad. Yeah. You have that kind of debut, um, anxiety about like not being in your culture and close to people that you know you love.

Joey: Yeah. I’m sure a lot of immigrants feel, feel the same exact way that you do, but yeah. You, you outlined a lot of certain privileges that you, you were able to Yes. Enjoy, benefit from.

David: I guess some wouldn’t be able to, which is, you know Well, that’s right. I think, you know, having the money to be able to fly back and forth makes, makes a big difference and, uh, and obviously work paid for that for a lot of the time as part of my job. And then also, Renee, as well, the fact that she wanted to go to England made a difference.If I had met somebody that was like, really, I’m not moving out of New Jersey, then it would have been a whole different, a whole different ballgame.

Joey: So, what do you miss the most about the UK?

David: Well, as I said, friends and family. Uh, but if I think beyond that, um, certain aspects of the culture. Like, you know, you and I might have a conversation about American football.

I can’t go much beneath the surface. Whereas, like, my game is soccer, is Premier League football. So You know, and cricket I love as well. Like you, you know, you grow up with those sports. And I’m not able to have conversations with people here in the way that I can with my English friends and friends from home. So, little kind of connection points like that, um, are a bit of a compromise. But all the good things far outweigh those relatively small things.

Joey: So, what would you say the biggest difference is in American culture and British culture? Well,

David: I think there are good things and there are bad. I think the good things about America is, you know, there’s a sense of optimism and belief and hope.

Yeah. And a can do attitude and service is excellent and, you know, people get stuff done here, you know, they don’t see any barriers. Irrespective of what, uh, class or cult, uh, class you come from, you’re just like, go for it, go for it. Whereas in the UK, there’s a little bit, um, You know, a few more constraints, as I say, it’s a smaller country, there aren’t as bigger, uh, commercial opportunities.

And, there’s a kind of criticism that’s within, within the culture there. It’s like, um, like slightly negative. Yeah, it’s like, America’s glass half full and the UK’s glass half empty. People There’s this sort of, um, Negativistic. Pessimistic, yeah. Yeah, it’s just like an older culture that’s seen maybe thousands of years of wars and misery and it’s built into the way people think and, and, and, you know, uh, and are

Whereas here, I just feel released to kind of get on with life without constraints. And that, that’s a beautiful thing. There are many negative things about American culture, I don’t like the gun crime, you know, I think the massive differences between rich and poor, the fact that, um, you know, there isn’t necessarily support, medical support for people that, um, you know, have less, uh, means, um, there’s certain pressures in society here, uh, that don’t exist, you know, in the UK to the same degree, um, so, you know, but, you know, You know, I don’t think America’s cut out for everyone.

 You, you, you’ve been born here, you live here. This is the culture that you know and understand, but coming in as an outsider, you can really see the kind of, some of the problems that America has. You’re all aware of those problems. Yeah, yeah. But, um, you know, I do have a choice. I could go home, uh, but I don’t want to, because America, the American Dream’s worked out very well for me.

Joey: Yeah, as, as many immigrants. Mm hmm. Um, so. Was it easy for you to integrate into American culture and society, being from England? It

David: was, it was kind of in the sense that I’m quite an outgoing person, I speak the language, you know, I had a job, and I wasn’t really struggling or suffering, but kind of deep in my heart early on I was pretty homesick.

You know, truth be told, I’d left Freddie back in England. Yeah, a lot of the people I was dealing with in England didn’t really understand America and they were like, you know, like a bit down on the business So why isn’t it bigger, faster? There’s a lot of pressure on me. Because it’s America?

Joey: Sorry? Because it’s America?

David: Well, yeah, because you imagine my manager in England saying well, why isn’t the business a hundred million dollars? You know, why aren’t you going to Walmart and making a big success overnight? Well, I’m here. It’s actually a lot harder than that You know for a list of reasons. There’s this kind of Lack of understanding of the country, which made just dealing with, you know, my business very hard.

It was really, it’s really tough. So I remember, you know, having like pretty dark periods, you know, in those first few years. It wasn’t easy. Um, it’s funny how you look back on it now and think, oh, it was fantastic. But it was actually really difficult. I felt very homesick. Um, but it all changed when I met Aunt Renee.

Seriously, you know, when I met Aunt Renee, and then was introduced to, you know, Jo and Phyllis, the family, I started to feel some of that support that I had in England, you know, and then I didn’t feel quite as homesick, um, because it’s not just about a job, it’s about family, it’s about feeling accepted, you know, having a social life over here, you know.

David: All of those things take a long time to establish. You don’t, it doesn’t kind of happen overnight.

Joey: So, would you say like having like a supportive, like, like family, like you were saying like every day. Yeah. Like my, my grandparents in Seattle and such, like you, would you say that, um, influenced your decision like staying here in the long term or?

David: 100 percent.

Yeah. If I hadn’t have met, you know. and we hadn’t established a life, then I probably would have gone back. You know, there might have been There were certain events that happened from a business point of view that give you the opportunity to kind of start afresh. Change of job, change of ownership of the company.

But, you know, I stuck it out because I started to establish all of those nice things that, you know, give life, uh, give life meaning. 

Joey: Um, so, what were your main struggles that you encountered when you were being an immigrant here? I know you mentioned those dark periods that you had before. Do you have any like specific struggles that you can refer to?

David: I think developing, uh, friendships and social life. I had a very good life around work. So I was busy with work, I was going back and forward. But I remember, like, having a rented place in Manhattan. I didn’t know whether I’d be going back to England or whether I’d be staying here. You know, I didn’t know whether to buy a, like a TV, or a sofa, or, you know, should I get myself a really nice one?

Oh, I could be going back in a few months. So this whole sense of being, living temporarily, well, I had a green card, but, you know, do I really want to stay here? Yeah, and it was awful, you know, um, when you’re living in this kind of limbo situation. Mm hmm. A degree of indecisiveness. Yeah. Yeah. I had a foot in both countries.

Exactly, yeah. Yeah. And it’s like, then you meet somebody, it’s like, well how do you present yourself to them? Um. You know, I’m British, yes, clearly. I live in America and I’m here to stay, or, you know, or do I talk about what’s in my heart? It’s like, well, I’ve got a son in England, I might go back. If this work doesn’t, if this job situation doesn’t develop positively, then I might have to go back.

David: You know, there’s lots of kind of uncertainty, and it wasn’t really, I would say, at least five years into being here that I could honestly put my hand up and say, you know. I’m ready to buy a 75 inch flat screen tv. That’s wild. Or a car years. Yeah. That’s

Joey: crazy. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like you mentioned before, like it’s like you’re splitting two, like two halves in two different countries.

Yeah. Yeah. That’s, I never knew that. That’s interesting.

David: I think for some immigrants, they, they’re leaving behind a very difficult situation, let’s say a war or poverty. You know, and they’ve just got to grit their teeth and get on with it, but they’ll be facing racism, they’ll be facing economic uncertainty here, but, you know, they’re deciding in their heads that, you know, toss of the coin, it’s probably better here.

I haven’t got those sorts of pressures, but I’ve got different pressures, you know, um, so it was It was, it was difficult, but in a, in a different way. Gotcha.

Joey: Um, did you ever see yourself moving back to England at all? I remember, you mentioned before, yeah, the

David: Yeah, well, obviously Freddy, you know, is a factor in my life.

Um, and my father’s not well at the moment. He’s, uh, got dementia, which is very sad. And it’s like, I’m thinking, well, he’s 82. He’s probably got, like, maybe 10 years to live. He’s going to need some support. But then, so it’s still kind of like I’m split in my head, you know, in some respects. But I’ve built up much more over here now, you know, in terms of family and my homes and sailing.

 I went back to London, won’t be able to sail, you know. But it’s still, it’s still kind of there in my head, you know, to be honest. But, you know, whereas let’s say when I first moved here, it was like 50 50, I could go back. Now it’s like it would have to be it’s like 80 percent say it 20 percent go back.

Yeah, but sometimes I think you know, maybe naively Oh, I could go back and retire Watch cricket That’s probably a silly idea that’s like me imagining what England was like in the 1980s not really what England’s like now and you know My friends have all gone round the world and, you know, I’d be going back to a very different place.

Joey: So, you mentioned that it’s different now, so how has, like, the English sign changed?

David: Yeah, it’s a good, interesting question. Um, well, to take one aspect, when I left in the late 90s, early 2000s, the food restaurant scene was not so good. Yeah, Bismoy. Yeah, it wasn’t good. London had a bad reputation. You know, culinary reputation, but over the years we’ve been back and restaurants are fantastic in London.

London’s a really clean place, you know, compared to New York. They have invested in infrastructure in the way that they have in New York. Um, the subway system’s really good, whereas it’s a bit dangerous going on the subways in America. Yeah. But, um, but, you know, many problems in the UK, like there are in the US.

You know, there’s a Divided society, you know, half of the country wanted to leave Europe, other half wanted to stay in, problems with politicians, just like there are problems with politicians here, here, you know, the economy has grown there, so the quality of life is good. But challenges with immigration from, you know, uh, Mediterranean, uh, States and Africa, you know, so, there are similar challenges for the society there.

 So, um, but, uh, yeah, so pros and cons of both, both countries. Yeah, it seems that

there’s a lot of similar, like, things that are wrong with the UK system and the American system.

Joey: Yeah. But, you guys have a lot more social programs, a lot more stuff like that, too.

David: Yeah, it’s, it’s, exactly, yeah, it is. And I think, you know, different stages of your life, you really need those.

Yeah, exactly. Like, when you’re old, do you really want to be paying 100, 000 a year to be taken care of? It’s like you’ve got to have some serious wealth. Um, you know, whereas in the UK, you know, the national health system is free. So, you know, you get sick, somebody will look after you, somebody will, you know, take care of you, um, whereas in the U.S. you’ve got to kind of have insurance and go private and there are expenses associated to that. So that is a consideration, but, you know, I’m hopefully not going to be in a situation where I’ll, uh, you know, I’ll have the resources to be able to pay for medical. So, how

Joey: would you, like, referring back to politics and stuff like that, like, how would you compare English politics and American politics since you’ve been in both countries?

David: Yeah, well, both countries are democratic, in the sense that, you know, there’s a democracy, there’s an openness, freedom of speech. Um, and there’s a political process that’s very similar. You know, here you’ve got, obviously, the Republicans and the Democrats, and in the UK you’ve got The Conservatives and the Labour Party, and it’s switched, it’s twitches every four years, you know, often from the right side to the left side to the right side, and there’s similar bickering going on in both countries.

Um, but I think here Government doesn’t get as involved, you know, they, obviously there’s taxation, uh, and there are laws, um, but in the UK, the government get more heavily involved, you know, whether that’s penalising businesses with higher taxes or controls over mergers and acquisitions and, you know, there’s more government intervention in the UK, whereas there’s a freedom in the system here.

Which I think actually helps the, uh, helps business and also there’s a transparency here, you know, like Freedom of Information Act or the Supreme Court process, whereas in the UK it’s just not as visible, you know, it’s kind of like it goes on behind the scenes and you kind of, you gratefully accept whatever’s given to you, whether that’s a decision by a judge or whether that’s a tax that’s owed at the end of the year, whereas here, um, yeah.

You just, it’s a couple of clicks away on the internet or call your, you know, local senator, you know, and you’ll generally get more, more of an understanding about kind of what the hell’s going on in the UK. It’s a bit more of a closed system. But politics, they’re not a million miles different, really. It doesn’t seem like it.

No, I think the American political system was based on, you know, the Houses of Parliament and the House of Lords in the UK. We’ve obviously got royalty, which you haven’t got here. The queen or king now doesn’t really get involved in politics, but it’s a stabilizing aspect of society which is different.

And it’s interesting what, you know, looking at royalty from a US point of view, you know, but understanding it from a British point of view. It’s a pretty amazing thing. Yeah, it is. It is kind of interesting,

David: like, seeing the king and the queen or whatever. Yeah. That whole setting. Yeah, yeah.

Joey: It’s kind of, it’s kind of unusual.

David; Yeah. It’s a little bit like, Aunt Renee calls it sort of Disneyland. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But it’s real. It’s like a movie. You know, but those people are real. And as a British citizen, it does have an impact on you. Kind of, like, the way you feel about the world and life. It gives you this feeling that, you know Life isn’t going to just suddenly change, there’s this sort of feeling of security and belief that things are going to be the same.

Whereas in this country, things are a little kind of uncertain. Stuff does happen. Yeah. And the world does change, you know, which means that you’ve got to kind of Fight for it yourself. Whereas in the UK, people, Oh, well, you know, Queen’s been a revolving king, queen, the royal family have been around for thousands of years, it’s going to continue in the future, you know, therefore my life is stable.

So it’s, it kind of affects the way your view of society in the world. That’s, that’s interesting. Yeah, it’s a positive thing, really. Yeah, no, it seems like it. It’s a cause to celebrate every now and then. Yeah. We were saying, what do we celebrate? Oh, maybe like 4th of July. Yeah, exactly. Getting away from the British.

Joey: Good. Um, so I guess, uh, this is my, like, my final question. Okay. Uh, do you have any regrets about permanently moving to the United States, or

David: no? Well, I’ve become American in my viewpoint. No regrets at all. I’m half sold. Uh, do I have any regrets? No, it’s a choice I made, you know, and it’s a choice that’s enriched my life, you know, I am a product of the American dream.

Yeah. But, you know, at the same time, I still feel very close to my British culture and I’ve got the good fortune of going back regularly and being a part of, you know, Europe and an international kind of citizen. Um, so, no, I’ve got, I’ve got no regrets at all. I just wish, you know, maybe. I’d done it sooner.So that I’ve got more life to lead, you know, in the position that I am now.

Joey: Yeah, well, good. Yeah, thank you for the interview. Excellent. Yeah.

David: Thanks, Joe. Appreciate it.

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