Proudly Turkish

[00:00:00] Bree

What is your name? 

Burçin

My name is Burçin. My last name is Yavuz. 

Bree

Okay. And how old are you? 

Burçin

Oh my God. (laughs) I am 32 years old. 

Bree

32? You look like you’re like, in your 20s. 

Burçin

Oh, thank you. 

Bree

So where is home for you? 

Burçin

My home is where I was born, Edremit Balıkesir in Turkey.

Bree

Okay. 

Burçin

We call Turkey.  It’s a internationally actually.

Bree

Okay. And, do you live with anyone back at home?  

Burçin

I’m kind of like living with my mom and my dad. And kind of many houses. It’s weird, but I try to share my weeks, my days with them. I don’t live alone. But if I want, I have a house to live alone too. 

Bree

You mainly live with your mom and dad? 

Burçin

Yeah, they are separated. And sometimes I stay with, like, a couple days with my mom, couple days with my dad. Also, I have, like, another summer house. I can live there, too, if I want. Also, I have my grandma’s house. She’s not there. She passed away. It’s free. We use it as our guest house. So, I can live there, too. So, I’m kind of like, I can live wherever I want.

Bree

What made you want to come to Harrisonburg?   

Burçin

I was studying tourism management actually, and I wanted to do something internationally. And I have a history with the United States as a J-1 student before all other, like, intercultural programs. And I have, like, I was thinking it’s a great opportunity to get it before I’m too old.  So, that’s why I applied. We have the tourism internship program. And, I’m here. 

Bree

Awesome. Wait, so what is a J-1 student? Like, exactly. 

Burçin

So, the J-1 students, you are studying in your country, or I don’t know, like other countries too. And, we have like a different kind of intercultural programs you can attend. When you were studying, you have to be a student, or you should have some experience. You should not have, like, um, more time before you graduate. Maybe the first year of graduation, you can attend some programs. So, that’s why you get the J-1 visa. We call, like, a student visa. So you can come here as a temporary. You can not stay forever, you finish your program, and you go back your country. That’s kind of an agreement.  

Bree

So, there are multiple programs. 

Burçin

Yeah.  

Bree

You chose the Harrisonburg one. 

Burçin

Yes, and this is my first to third intercultural program that I’m trying. 

Bree

Okay. But you’ve done multiple other programs?

Burçin

Yes.  

Bree

So you’re currently in an education program, like, right now? 

Burçin

Yes. People are not aware of that we are paying too. 

Bree

Oh, okay. 

Burçin

Especially my second program was, um, intercultural childcare program. And I was an au pair, and my host family didn’t know that I had to pay too. They were in shock, like, no, I pay too, like, yeah. But, um, I know that some countries you don’t have to pay. Other programs, some countries, you pay a lot or less. It depends where are you. 

Bree

So you just wanted to do it because you wanted to further your education. 

Burçin

Yeah, also whatever I paid, I earned back. 

Bree

Gotcha. Okay.

Burçin 

It works, I mean.  

Bree

Okay, so, um, did you come alone?

Burçin

Yeah. 

Bree

Was that scary, or? 

Burçin

No.  

Bree

No, because you’re doing it a lot?

Burçin

Maybe the first time, it was kind of scary. But, actually, it’s my fourth time. Of course, you feel, like, weird, but, um, I spent many years in United States before. I, I felt like I’m coming back my little home, too. I know, so I didn’t really feel weird. Of course, it’s kind of scary because the first time in Virginia, I have never been here before. I have never worked in this business. Like, at the front desk, actually. And, of course, it’s kind of, like, exciting. A little, maybe, scary, because the new environment, you don’t know, there’s no family, there’s no friends. You’re gonna make friends, but you don’t really know if you can make it or no. So, you should have a little bit brave to do it.  

Bree

I was going to say, you sound like you’re, like, very good at just traveling and getting used to- 

Burçin

Yeah. Because time flies. I mean, um, I had opportunity before to do those kind of like a programs when I was going to college, but I was so scared, and, to go another country to be alone. And I was kind of scared to learning English too. I know it sounds like, unnormal or weird, but it was my biggest scare, like, and after our graduation, I realized I don’t have any experience in another country, I don’t have, like, uh, English enough, because it’s an international language, that you have to know, and then I decided, you know what, if I cannot do that, nobody’s gonna make it for me, so, let’s do it.

Bree

So then where did you learn your English?  Like what was your experience with that? 

Burçin

Okay, so we, we started to learn English at school. Actually they are teaching us since like we were going like a primary school, high school or everything. But you don’t really know the English if you don’t go another country. Which their main language is English because whatever I know, it was like, uh, nothing.  When I came here first, my boss asked me my name. I was like looking his face because the accent, the grammar, I was like, I was thinking like, I’m sorry. I was thinking I’m not that much idiot. I know. I know some English. I’m like, oh my God. I was crying, actually, like, my first program. A couple weeks, I was crying. I was thinking, like, um, I’m never gonna learn this language. It’s too hard. Whatever I learn, it’s kind of maybe another language, but not the English. And other friends and my co-workers helped me. Gave me some, like, a positive vibe that you can handle it. And I tried to do everything to learn, and I did. 

Bree

So what, what is your first language? 

Burçin

Turkish. 

Bree

Turkish, so did, were there other like Turkish people that, like, worked here that helped you with 

that, or? 

Burçin

No, there was no Turkish, um, So, I never met other like a Turkish, Turkish J1s.

Bree

Oh, okay. 

Burçin

So actually, when I came here first, like, in United States, I told the people, whoever, you know, Turkish people, don’t let me introduce.  Because, um, if you don’t stop talking your main language, you can never learn English. 

Bree

Oh, okay. So you just really submersed yourself. Wow.

Burçin

Yeah, like, because I’m like, if I want to learn this I need to do whatever it takes, and I was even texting with my family, and I was trying to not to contact too much on the video, and it worked actually. I found my own way to learn this language, but I believe that everybody has different way to learn. Maybe it worked for me, but it may not work for other people, too. 

Bree

Gotcha. So, your friends that you were making were more for, like, moral support? Not really, like,  like, helping you learn from Turkish to English? 

Burçin

Yeah, um, how it works I was working in kitchen. So, actually…

Bree

So, that was your first job like, here in the U. S.? 

Burçin

Yeah. Okay. I came with work and travel program. I was Dishwasher and the housekeeper. I’m like who I’m gonna talk with the sheets and the dishes and nobody believed that I will come here do this jobs and can improve because I’m not waitress like I’m not at the front line to contact with people. Then as I said, I cried a lot  and our chef Helen talked to me and she said, um, “Burçin, you know what, I understand what you feel because I was upset, like, yes, we pay to come here, but we don’t pay the people to contact with us. It’s not their job to teach us English. So it’s your job to find a way to learn this language in United States.” So, um, she told me that, she promised.  When I left here, when I go back to my country, I will speak fluently. Which I did because after three months I was on the international Congress and presenting my own, um, paperworks. And I was shocked too, because yeah, like I wasn’t expecting this from myself too, but… Yeah, I did everything. I was talking with waitress and even they asked me to wash something even if they ask, like a fork. I’m just giving an example. I was asking “why?” It was my keyword. Why whatever they asked I was like a replaying why what do you mean?

[00:10:00] Why I need fork? No, why because “why” make the people talk to you. So, if you just give the fork and turn your back, nobody talks to you. And, whenever, however I was tired, it doesn’t matter, after I finished my work, I took my bag, went to bar, and sit at the, like a, you know, you can sit at the bar. And I was trying to talk with people. Even it’s the enough language, or no. That’s how it improved. And then the second time, and the third time, and this is the fourth time. I believe it’s not really like a professional language level that I reached, but I can survive.  

Bree

Well, I mean, it’s great. Like, we’re having conversations, so I’d say it’s gotten you far. So, sorry to backtrack. What, when you were talking about, like, presenting in front of Congress..? 

Burçin

Yeah, it was kind of like a  Textile and Design Congress. So, I was writing a thesis, and I graduated from the fashion design. And I was doing my master degree. On a subject. And my professor told me that there’s an opportunity to present. But I was right before to come in United States and I had to prepare all the paperwork. And when I went back, I found myself in the presentation  that I have to present what I’m studying on. And like, I was just talking to people. They were asking me questions, and my professor was shocked too, like me. And I don’t really remember the name. 

Bree

Did you have to present it in English? 

Burçin

Yeah. 

Bree

Oh, okay, so that’s why. That’s why you were so, like-

Burçin

Yeah, and people were asking in English because it was international. It was held in Istanbul. Like, all the professors, like, uh, They were kind of other countries, too.  And this is an international language to contact with the people if you want them to understand you. 

Bree

Gotcha. What did traveling look like for you? Like when you came from Turkey to the U. S., how did you get here the first time, and then, like, the second time?

Burçin

The programs? 

Bree

Well,  how did you get here? 

Burçin

Oh, with plane (laughs). 

Bree

Okay, so on a plane, like, with tickets and all that. Was that, like, difficult to navigate? Or, like, understand the first time you started traveling, or?  

Burçin

My first flight experience, never been in Turkey. I didn’t even fly between cities. My first flight, like, experience with plane was from Turkey to United States. And, yeah, you get excited because, like,  they are very careful. All the officers on the way, you stop somewhere like, for the second flight, you have to be careful because our advisors were telling us, be careful if they ask you something like, kind of like a did you prepare your luggage? Oh yes, yes I did. Don’t, don’t tell them your mom helped you. No, so for like a security issues. So. Yeah, I stopped like, uh, first one, I believe it was like a Amsterdam, the second one was Paris, the other one was Barcelona, and this flight was non stop flights. Oh my god, and it made me more tired, I thought it’s maybe the better, but it made me more tired. I was thinking, oh, it’s gonna be easier, I don’t have to stop somewhere, show my passport again, pass all the, like, customs, and blah, blah, blah.  No, I’m not going to do it again. I want to stop somewhere, put my feet somewhere in Europe and walk a little bit.

Bree

So, was getting  a work visa like a long process or was it kind of-

Burçin

Yes, it is. 

Bree

Oh, really? 

Burçin

Especially, even you’re a J1, there’s always actually like a 90 percent chance to get denied. It’s all like, I can’t say like a lock, whatever you do.  I know it’s weird, but even you go to embassy,  you know, you get your appointment, you have to pay for your appointment. And even they say no, the money is gone. You have, even you want to get the second one, you have to pay again. They don’t give you back. So, it’s not even cheap, like it’s expensive. Even you compare with the currency. Like,  I’m not even talking about the program payment. I’m not even talking about the flight tickets. Or something like that. And, they are asking, how is your school? Like, if you are like successful.  I don’t even think you can apply something if you have –

Bree

Just for a work visa.

Burçin

Yeah,  for the work, for the, even for the J one. Like you’re literally intercultural program. You are trying to get in and.  Even if they look at you, if they don’t like your beard, like, if they don’t like your talking style, they can say no. There’s no explanation. 

Bree

So did you work every time that you’ve come to the US?

Burçin

Yes. 

Bree

Okay. And so did you have to redo that every time? 

Burçin

Yes. 

Bree

Oh my gosh. That’s, wow, that’s a lot.

Burçin

Yeah, I mean, it worked. I have  nothing to do better in my country. I mean, I was always trying to do something before it’s too late because I believe that time flies and you need to do something when you are healthy, when you are young. I can’t do those in my 40s or 50s.  And I always tell people when they go to college, like, do it right now. Don’t even hesitate. Don’t be scared. I know I want to do the same thing. And I’m so regret. I wish I had someone to support me. I mean, my sister told me to do that because she came here before me. It’s a work and travel program. Another, like a  J-1 student visa.  But, um, people need to feel that inside, like, it’s time, let’s do it. Like that motivation. Yeah, and however you give them motivation, if they don’t feel, they don’t do that. Even you know they’re going to be successful. So, I focus on myself. I still give advice to people, but my priority is me. 

Bree

That’s good.  Do you have a lot of siblings?

Burçin

I have only one older sister and yeah, she’s, she was always successful in her life, all the education and all the work. And she taught me the first intercultural program, with work and travel. She came here before.  And she always told me, you can do it. You can learn English. Don’t scare. Like, but I was so scared. Like,  but, uh,  now she can’t take me back. Right. 

Bree

Where does she live? 

Burçin

She’s living in Istanbul. Okay. And she’s a textile engineer. And, uh, NCY. It’s kind of like, uh, Europe, um, textile company. Kind of like a Primark. But it’s in Turkey. So,  she’s a good example for me. She’s like a top notch.  

Bree

That’s awesome. Okay. So, did you feel welcomed when you arrived to the U. S.? 

Burçin

Yes. Always. Always. Like, wherever. I still contact with people. Like, my first year, second year, third year, like, I still contact with my first boss  and where I was working. In Wisconsin, as work and travel students, and he was the owner of the hotel. We still contact, and he is already retired, sold like a hotel and everything. He’s traveling around the Europe. Sometimes he finds a job offer for me, and he make all the contacts. And I still contact with the family. I was an au pair. Like, I still contact with them. They’re in Massachusetts.  Even with them I was feeling like a since first day to the last day, I was feeling like a princess, not like a Au pair or the worker like they are they were so welcome. And that’s kind of things. I believe that I was lucky to be happy wherever I went, because I had another friends and they were living in maybe like a some kind of better conditions, but they were not happy. So, like, I’m just giving an example. I was taking care of four kids,  yeah, and like a triplets, and they had brother. I love them, and my host family, like, they were the loveliest people ever. And some people had, like, only one baby and they were not happy with, with their family.  That’s why you need to feel that you were, like, welcomed,  you’re loved. Wherever you are, they want you with them. Even you work, even you leave. Like,  I had like a good co workers, I had good boss, and my boss’s dad was calling me his, uh, Turkish grandkid. And my host family, I was calling them my brothers, and they were like accepted me there like a sister. So, yeah,  I had a good connection all the time and here too, and I believe I have good supervisors, good manager, and they’re kind of like a taking care of us.They feel this responsibility.

[00:20:00] I don’t know the other places, but  I felt like I’m welcome. Yeah.  Yeah. 

Bree

So, um. Were there any social or political services that helped you along in integrating,  like getting used to living here?  

Burçin

No, not any like a, I can’t say any government things. Yeah.

Bree

Gotcha.

Burçin

Like, no, like, um. Like, they’re preparing us, not the government, but, you know, like, um, we have the companies and intercultural programs have their own companies and companies contact with them, like with each other. So our company,  they help us to prepare what, what’s expecting us, like how this process went through. And except for it, you need to deal kind of everything by yourself. Even like, um, maybe other people, like we have kind of like a WhatsApp group that we were telling each other like, “Hey, there’s a text, like we have, do we have to make it? Do we have to like, uh,  do it or have to deal with something if we have any issue also with work and travel.” I believe some people had their, like, advisor, but I didn’t have, and as an au pair, I had an advisor. The sponsor helped us, but not here.

Bree

What is an au pair? 

Burçin

Au pair is kind of like an intercultural child care program. It’s another J1 visa. Okay. You have to study something. You have to be a student.  And  you literally come here. You live with an American family  and you help to taking care of kids and also the family because like kind of  sister  or like, I can’t say daughter, maybe like a part of the family. So it’s not like a work work and they’re expecting you to help them not like kind of work and also, it’s kind of like a  Intense, because you are literally living 24 hours in the same house. Like, you know, here, when I’m done with work, at the front desk, I take my bag, come to my unit, and I do whatever I want. But au pair, kind of like a different program, you’re literally living in the same house. Like, I just go to my home, I mean, go to my room. So  But, um, if you don’t have a good connection,  so that might be, like, overwhelmed for you because you cannot shut the door to kids because you love those family, like, those kids, or like, parents, like, you’re leaving, and think about you leave with your parents,  so you’re kind of, like, you’re becoming part of the family. And another thing, like, uh, of course it’s kind of like a job too. You have to work, like, some hours. They have to give you those hours because they’re also paying you.  Like, um, you still have social security. They still, uh, pay you, um, weekly. But you don’t have to pay your rent or, like, any bill. You’re not responsible on your, like, a meal. And they also have to send you a school.  You have some credits that you have to finish. You may apply, um, a language course, which I didn’t prefer.  I wanted to go another, like, courses.  And they also pay some of  those, um,  school things. I don’t really know, like, right now, but they have to, like, they have to pay too. 

Bree

Okay. So, how long have you been visiting the US? 

Burçin

Since 2015.

Bree

Since 2015, wow, that’s a while. So do you like feel American at all?

Burçin

No.

Bree

No?

No.  Because it’s my fourth time and everybody’s asking, hey, are you gonna apply for a green card? Hey, do you want to get the like American citizenship or whenever I want to Turkey, they’re asking. I’m like no, because I’m happy with being Turkish and I believe that if you want to be the citizen of the country, another country, you have to feel that.  And I don’t feel or I have no wishes. I’m okay with visiting here, working like a temporary. And I like kind of like being in American culture. But I don’t feel like American. I have no wishes to be citizen.  So, yeah. 

Bree

Okay, so like no plans to naturalize?

Burçin

I mean, life has full of surprise, so let’s not shut the door. But no, I mean, I also have second citizenship, so.

Bree

Okay.

Burçin

Technically I can’t get the third one and I need to get rid of the one of them.

Bree

Burçin

Oh.  So I don’t want it to, I’m okay. Like I, I don’t know.

Bree

I mean, yeah.

Burçin

Yeah, but I’m not gonna apply for the citizenship or something. 

Bree

Well, yeah. I mean, I guess if just visiting works for you and you love it, then why not keep doing it?

Burçin

I believe it’s a good experience to tell my grandkids in the future, in the Christmas time, like over the New Year time, New Year Eve time. We usually don’t celebrate the Christmas, but. I mean, whenever I blow my, um, candle of my birthday cake, I wish that I want to get the good, um,  stories. Stories to tell my grandkids in the future. 

Bree

So do you have kids back in Turkey?

Burçin

No. I’m talking about the future.  I don’t know. I don’t know yet. 

Bree

So do you miss home a lot then?

Burçin

No (laughs).

Bree

No?

Burçin

It’s a second weird answer. I don’t know. And again, everybody’s asking this. No, I never felt like homesick. Even my first year. Because I used to live  far away from my family.  And like, when I was going to college, the four years degree and then a master degree, it’s almost seven, eight years.  We have kind of like a eight hours, twelve hours difference from my hometown to my college. So I was not able to back and forth like visiting them. So…

Bree

So where was your hometown and then where was your college? 

Burçin

So, my hometown is like Edirne, Tbilisi, kind of like a west coast. And my college was, in my university was kind of middle of to Turkey, next to the capital city Eskişehir. So, I would like, I was maybe visiting them the last year. Months, once in four months, maybe six months.

Bree

So, you’ve gotten used to it?

Burçin

Yeah, and I used to live alone too. So, I used to be best friend of mine. And, yeah, of course I miss sometimes. But not like, oh my god, I’m dying with the whole thing. Like, I can’t survive with that. I did before and yeah. And I found something better way to, uh, not to miss them so much, not visiting them, to make them visit me. 

Bree

Have they visited you here before?

Burçin

Yes, they did. I mean, my dad did.  I had an opportunity that when I was an au pair, my family wanted me to, wanted me to stay with them more because  not this programs, work and travel or the tourism management or the internship program don’t, uh, give you this opportunity, but if you apply for the au pair program, they give you an option. If you want to do extend. One year, nine months, or six months, or are you done with the program? So, I love my family, my host family, and they love me. They gave me, uh, offered me to stay with them.  And I told them to, I can, and I extended nine more months.  So, and they also told me, hey, um,  I had an opportunity to visit my family. To come back before I finish my first year because the visa situation. You cannot leave the country if you finish and make the extension. That’s a different kind of visa situation you have to follow.  And they offered me, hey, do you want to go to Turkey, visit them, come back? And I said like, you know what, it’s like,  going back, like, visiting them and coming back here, it’s going to be harder. And guess what? I’ll bring my dad here and we apply for the visa for him, the tourist visa. Right. And my family helped me to, uh, host family helped me too. They send a letter.  Is, dad can stay with us like they’re welcome or something. And he got the visa and he visited me.

Bree

That’s awesome.

Burçin

And like he was 60 years old living an American dream and he was. I just keep telling him, thank you, we’re visiting like Washington, New York, and everything.

Bree

So, he got the whole experience.

Burçin

Yeah.

Bree

So was it easier for him to visit then because you were already kind of like an in?  

[00:30:00] Burçin 

So again, it depends because it’s not easy to get a visa at all for anything.

Bree

Mhm. Like any situation.

Burçin

But he was working for a government and they have different kind of passports. Even they get retired, they give like, I have the, uh, like kind of like a, like a dark purple visa.  Passport. They got like a green passport. If you are retired from government or if you’re working.  So, and he was like a 60 years old at that time. And American government, I believe that they’re careful to choose the people who they’re gonna give the visa even the working or the tourist visa  So they want to know and make sure when you come to United States, you’re gonna go back. And he did. And they kind of probably believed my dad. Like, after visit here, he’s gonna go back. And he did. I mean, now I’m trying to do the same thing for my family. Other part of family. For my mom. And for my sister. 

Bree

Would that be as easy, though, to get them here? Like, with you living on your own and not with the family? Like,  the first time that your dad visited and you said that like your family like wrote a letter.

Burçin

Yeah, my host family.

Bree

Yeah. So would that be as easy for them to come visit now without having that?

Burçin

So that’s what I will do. I will just, um, send a letter by myself. I also send a letter to like, uh, Hey, you know what I’m working as a, like a. J1 student here. I would like to welcome my dad, visit, travel around, and take care of him. And, I don’t have a host family, but, I’ll probably send a letter, too, that I would like to have my family here, visit with them. Because they are not applying for a working visa, they are applying for a tourist visa. So, I don’t know. It’s totally a luck. I mean, it’s expensive luck, but  I want to try. Why not? I make my wish come true, and they can have, too. Like, they can visit with me here wherever they want to go. 

Bree

So you don’t get, like, lonely living alone?  

Burçin

I love it. I love being alone. I know it’s weird. I’m kind of like a private person, maybe, or I get used to it. So-

Bree

Well, what do you do for fun around here, then? 

Burçin

Well, I do everything at the resort. I go pool, I go Zumba, I go like a pound class-

Bree

Oh that’s right, you live on a resort.

Burçin

-like I’m going yoga and it’s helpful actually to tell the people what I’m doing. Like I give some advice to the guests. I’m like, did you go Zumba too? Are you living here? Yeah. I mean, this is kind of, kind of my home. So I cannot just sit in my unit and knock someone on my door, ask me if I’m being a friend, like,  I used to do something alone too. I go to drink coffee,  and like a Lyft coffee shop we have, I watch around, and 

Bree

That’s a pretty good place to be stationed, I guess.

Burçin

Yeah, like, I mean, I’m okay with friends too. I’m not like, I’m social, like, uh, but it’s kind of like a challenging of living in another country, you cannot just expect something, like, wherever you come. Hey, you know what? You won the 10 friends this month. No, like, if you get a friend, you get a good friend. I have many friends in other states that I was working as a J-1 student.  And I have other friends too, but I’m not kind of like addictive.Hey, you know what? Let’s go to movie if you don’t come with me. I’m probably not gonna go. No, I’m gonna do it alone. Sometimes I like to do it alone.  So, yeah, sorry, I don’t feel home sick that much.  

Bree

No, I mean, that’s your experience with that. So, that’s cool to do that stuff by your own.

Burçin

I’m not selfish.  

Bree

No, no, I, like, I applaud that. Like, just do whatever is fun.

Burçin

Yeah. I don’t like to wait and do it by myself, having, by myself, like having fun. 

Bree

Yeah, I just was wondering what it was like to be in somewhere that’s not home for you, on your own. But, you kind of just-

Burçin

So, I believe that, um,  yes, where you were born, it’s your home. Or like, you don’t have to be born, like, uh, wherever you grow up, wherever you are family, actually, it might be your home. But if you have to leave your country, coming another country, kind of, you’re taking your home with you. So wherever you go, it’s gonna be your home too. Maybe temporary. You just need to accept, hey, you know what?  That’s my temporary home. That’s why I like to decorate my unit. I know it’s a temporary one and I like to buy some home stuff, but people are looking at me, why? Because I’m living here. This is my home- temporary.

Bree

So how much longer are you going to be in Harrisonburg? 

Burçin
So, yeah, this whole year program, and it’s my probably, I’m almost done with the fifth month. And I’ll be here until July, first of July.  And we also have, all the J-1s has a right, other programs do. They have right to stay and visit in United States like 30 days. So  I have a big plan, a big plan for it, especially if my family get a visa, afford a tourist visa. We are planning to do something, and, but you cannot work, so I will be finished like the first of July.

Bree

Okay, I think that is all of my questions, actually.

Burçin

That’s it?

Bree

That is all, that is it. So, um, if you had anything else, like, you wanted to share?

Burçin

I don’t know,  You can ask me anything, it doesn’t have to be on the list.

Bree

Um, so, do you have like a sense of community that made it feel easier for you. Like if getting to know the people who are also living.

Burçin

Here?

Bree

Yeah. If that helped you at all feel more at home. 

Burçin

Um,  yeah like, I also am not like uh, what do you say, like a close, person. I liked maybe kind of like a culture because  They’re kind of like an agency  side, looking kind of like a Mediterranean. Warm people, you know, I like to communicate with people even like I’m talking with everybody. It doesn’t have, it doesn’t, they, they don’t have to be guests. Like, other departments, housekeeping, security, like, “hey, how are you, how’s your day going,” like, and other, like, co workers, maybe the J-1s. But, some people not like, uh, warm like you. So, I’m trying also to understand them, what they’re like a personal level or the communication level. So not like jumping in like all the conversation. So, yeah, I mean, you need to contact with them. You cannot leave all by yourself, all another country. No, but if even like a minimum conversation on the way, when you’re tired,  just given an example, like a security taking us back, our unit, “Hey, how was your day?” It was fine. We didn’t, we’re surviving. You’re not dead. Like, Oh, how was your day? It was fine. Like we want something. And it’s a good conversation.  It keep up everybody you’re sharing your daily life.  And I believe it affects everybody around you too.  And what, like, I’m going to get a coffee, maybe. And I’m trying to talk to people, like, Hi, how was your day? And they ask me, Hey, are you the new one? Are you working at the front desk? Yes, I do. And sometimes they come to, like, sign something, “Hey, hi, how are you? I remember you.” Like,  You need to make your own home if you’re not  where you were born. So, I’m talking a lot, sorry! 

Bree

That’s perfect, like, it’s exactly what I, what I wanted, so I appreciate that.  

Burçin

So, I mean, like, what I can say… So, I had a good example, like, kind of like my grandma was raised me, and she was a German.  But she was living in Turkey and she kind of raised me and she was alone because she lost her husband when I was born the first year. We always had a good connection. We always like to do something by ourself and she liked to do something alone, too. So maybe she showed me how to live and to be strong and having fun  by herself as a, like a strong woman, as a independent woman. If they, if you wanna like having fun with other people, like get in public is, you can do, but also you don’t need anyone like. She was a good example for me, so. Maybe I’m kind of like copying her without realizing, so. 

Bree

Well, that’s awesome that you had that, to like, lead you where you are now. You’re very accomplished, like you’ve done a lot for your education, which is like very admirable, so.

[00:40:00] Burçin 

Yeah, it was, I did everything like, uh, as a hobby. Like, nobody forced me to do this, nobody forced me to get the fifth degree.

Bree

That’s hard, though.  I’m just trying to finish my first degree, so doing a fifth is a lot.

Burçin

Maybe I like to, like, push myself, like, forward. Even my family get confused. Like, sometimes they’re on the phone, like, with conversation. They’re talking about me. It’s like, my mom sometimes like, What you are studying right now? Like, which one is that? How many languages do you know? What are you studying? Because I’m kind of like studying German too. So, like, how many languages did you know that you want to know? Like, Mom, like, not many. Just Turkish, English, trying German.

Bree

That’s awesome.

Burçin

So, yeah.  I’m having fun, so kind of  stick to my personality.  

Bree

Sounds like you’re getting the most out of it, so.

Burçin

Yeah, I mean,  I don’t know. I need therapy to realize what is the explanation for it.  But, um,  this is your own life. Like, however, I’ll be maybe in another country, not the United States.  You need to realize this is your life. You need to write your own story. You decide.  Do you want to leave empty pages for one year? Or a couple sentences?  Or do you want to fill them all?  Because you don’t know what’s going to happen tomorrow. I mean, I’m not expecting to be in time, but you know?  When you’re healthy, if you don’t have any  strings to keep you, do it! Like, you’re the, you’re the only support, the biggest support yourself, and you’re the only reason not to do that, like,  you know,  some, sometimes people can be their own enemy or the biggest supporter. So, especially, like, sometimes I’m asking the people, like, around me, hey, why you don’t do that, why don’t do this, like, they’re like, um, hey, we want to do this too, because you’re also example, like, for your friends, for the other people, they’re following social media, or they know you. So, I told them, hey, you can do that too, but they said, “oh, we have a family, they don’t support us, I don’t have enough money,” like, blah, blah. I had those things too.  I had to work six hours in McDonald’s to save some money. I had to make my family believe that it is my, I don’t know how many degree that I’m having, but it’s going to be okay for me to come to United States and taking care of other people’s kids. Because, you know, “hey, you finished the fashion design. what are you doing in the, what are you going to do?” Like, sometimes you have to make them believe if they’re not going to believe you, you need to take your own responsibility. I don’t care. If you believe me, you can believe me. If you don’t want to believe me, that’s fine. It’s your own business. Watch me, what I’m doing. So, you have to be brave. You need to  believe yourself first that I’m going to do that. 

Bree

So you  looked for these programs yourself? 

Burçin

Yeah. Like even, uh, sometimes they said it’s impossible because of my age. And because of my education,  I didn’t have those education when I go back to United States. It was a COVID time when I was finished all the au pair programs. I was looking for, but what can I do to come back here, like extend my experience.  And I told maybe many companies  and they said, I don’t have any enough experience about this. on this business. I don’t have enough, uh, education. I’m like, me, I’m going to get it. Let’s start another degree. It’s not going to be so hard. So what you did, like when some, sometimes people tell me, well, what I’m going to do and get it this degree, how much is going to be hard then, life. 

Bree

Oh, okay. So I understand now. So it was just your first original, like, master’s degree that you got in Turkey, that was free education?

Burçin

No, it was all in Turkey.

Bree

Oh, okay.

Burçin

Not here. Okay, so-

Bree

Say, I feel like I need you to explain it for me. 

Burçin

Okay, got it. First, I finished my fashion design degree four years. And I look at my diploma-

Bree

And that was in Turkey?

Burçin

Yes. There is no English. There is no abroad experience. Nothing. And then I listened my sister to apply work and travel, but you have to be a student  to apply for this visa, for this program. And I said, okay, I’m going to be a student again. Let’s start master degree.  And I started my master degree.  Whenever I get my student paper, I just run to the company and like, “Get me this work and travel.” And then  I came to United States with a J-1 work and travel program. And I came back to Turkey. I told my professor don’t make me graduate. And he was like, “Why? I mean, you’re successful.” Because I want to do it again- you have to be a student.  So, I kind of like extended on the paperwork, my thesis, but I was already studying on it. I just needed to be a student, so. Okay. So, um, I applied again, actually, and I came back to the same place in Wisconsin, and my boss also like, uh, wanted me back too. I really like this place and everything.  And I came back to Wisconsin again as a J 1, as a work and travel program.  And then I went home.  I graduated from my master degree. I also was studying on brand communication. Another degree. So, I finished them all.  And then, um, I applied for au pair program.  So,  that’s why. It was another J-1 student visa program, intercultural. I came to Massachusetts 2000…  should be the 18 [2018] if I’m not wrong. And I stayed almost like two years. And I went back to  Turkey again. It was the COVID time.  So actually there was nothing to do except studying because you can’t go out.  You can’t have fun. There’s nothing like, there’s no social life. So I also like to study too.  And I call people, like a sponsor, if there’s any other programs, any other countries. And they knew my United States background, but some people told I’m too old because I was It’s like 29, 28 or something  and there’s an age limit and I don’t have like a  tourism experience. This is another like a American program, but I don’t have an experience. I don’t have a, uh, education. I’m like, okay, let’s study cultural heritage and tourism because my background is like an art, like art history classes that I was taking also in Massachusetts.  Like, I like to history, culture, all the design things and everything. And I took it.  And I  wanted to wait because there was no visa application on the COVID time. You can’t even apply for J-1. You can’t even apply for a tourist visa. I just waited until I wait. They opened the doors. I finished this two years degree. And then I applied tourism management and I also found a job at the front desk in my hometown to learn this business. So when I found the time, I applied tourism internship,  but I’m here.  Sorry, it’s a long story, but –

Bree

No you’re fine!

Burçin

So, I tell like there’s no reason for me, oh, I don’t have a degree, and to get a degree, I mean.

Bree

So, is there like, anything, any specific job you want to do with your extended degree? Or, what’s your reasoning behind it?

Burçin

I’m enjoying, like, it’s not kind of like, oh, I’m trying to do everything to get back to United States. No, I mean, if you can do it, you can study. It’s not like, kind of, hobby, actually. But. It is hobby for me, like, if I want to do something, you know what, let’s study on it, where you can learn, at the college, at the university, where is better place. No.

Bree

So it’s, it’s not like for one specific job, or like, idea?

Burçin

No, I want to be in the business where I can be involved in culture, arts. I maybe not, like, um,  give a name,  but whatever I do, might be, like, intercultural, so.

Bree

[00:50:00] Well, it sounds like you’ve got a lot of experience in that.

Burçin

Yeah, and I always think, like, don’t make your future dream, like, specifically. You may not reach that. Very well, but sometimes you make a goal for yourself. You can turn around until you get what you want. Might take one year, might take ten years. As soon as it makes you happy, where are you? So, don’t make, like, draw your borders.  So, don’t, don’t make yourself so, like-

Bree

defined?

Burçin

Yeah, like, you know, like, if you’re happy, I’m happy here.

Bree

So you’re just  pursuing what makes you happy?

Burçin

Yeah, like, I’m following my dreams. I’m trying to make my wish come true.  It’s given people, like, so much power. I wish everybody  can make it, but whoever works for it, who got, you know, not everybody can reach that. You need to  work for it. I wish you do too.

Bree

Thanks so much for everything, for like telling me all about your life.

Burçin

And I’m just having conversation with you. So when I say like, oh my god, like I need to be student again. What I’m gonna do? Like, let’s do a master degree. I’m not gonna go back and start the college first year. No, like go forward. Yeah, that’s why I like and I didn’t know what I’m going to study on the master’s degree, and  you’ll, oh my god, and what I found,  a subject, I was trying to find a professor in my college to, you know, you all, you write your thesis with them, a specific person,  like advisor,  and nobody wanted my topic. Everybody laughed at me. I’m serious. I’m serious, like,  wherever I opened my mouth, they were just- even the president of the faculty were like, oh, haha. And only one professor believed me, like, oh, we can do that. Why not? Like, because I was kind of like, wanted to study of, um, The costume  of an artist, like a singer  and in historical times and everybody like was laughing at me. Like, think about like, you want to study a Michael Jackson’s costume, kind of, but, uh, everybody was thinking it’s so, silly. And only I knew that this artist had an, design background. So, only one professor believed me, and I’m so lucky to have him at that time, because he helped me a lot. He believed me, and he, you know, I told you that I went to the Textile and Design Congress to present my studying, and he put me in this position, and everybody listened to me, and my own professors, they were there, too. They were watching me, other, with other people from other countries. At the beginning, they didn’t believe me. They didn’t believe my subject. They were laughing at me. But I found this person.

Bree

You just needed one person to give you that opportunity.

Burçin

Yeah, I just needed one person. And he helped me a lot. So, I always say, you want to study something? Do it. Run behind it. So, don’t feel like, oh my god. Like, they are kidding with me. They were literally kidding with me because like,  and don’t think like it’s kind of whatever you want to say. You may not find the subject right now.  Whatever you want to do, don’t believe so much with people what they’re thinking because they are thinking on their  level. Not your level.  So.

Bree

Thank you.

Burçin

Just a little advice for the future.

Bree

Thank you, I appreciate it. You’re like passing the torch on.

Burçin

Yeah, like,  from 32 years experience, like.  

Bree

Okay, well, I’ll probably end the interview here if that’s, if you’re good.  

Burçin

Whatever you need. You can ask me anytime, anything. I can do everything for school. You got me, right? I’ll tell you anything for school.

[54:38.5] Bree

Okay, right. Well, thank you for doing this interview. 

 

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