Interview With Annelize Getzschmann
Introduction:
I moved to the United States with my family when I was 9 so when I saw that there was a class about the sociology of immigration, I knew I had to take it. As a result, I found the class to be almost therapeutic as I got to learn new things about my parents decision to come to America from a sociological lens and I also began to understand better why I have a very different outlook on life than many of my friends. It was very comforting to hear many of the experiences that I’ve gone through in life be acknowledged through a class.
For this project, I decided to interview my mother who brought me to the United States along with my dad and my siblings in 2009. Now all fully naturalized citizens, the story of my family’s immigration follows a lot of the same concepts and theories that we talked about in class all semester. However, my parents already had extremely well established careers in South Africa to the point where money was no longer the biggest stress in their life. Therefore, they had no intention of ever leaving the country until the day my youngest brother Jens was born.
Summary:
Annelize Getzschmann immigrated to the United States with her family in early July of 2009. In 2018, Annelize and her family would become fully naturalized citizens after she took her oath. She also won the green card lottery within her first year of residency in the United States which enabled her family to ensure secure worry free residency in the United States. If someone told her in 2007 that she would be moving to the United States to live there permanently for potentially the rest of her life, she would have given that person a very puzzled look. However, the life of Annelize’s family would be turned upside down with the birth of her third child a year later. She made the decision to leave South Africa with her husband because their third child was born with Down Syndrome in January of 2008. This obviously wasn’t an easy decision to make especially since their entire family lived in South Africa on top of them already having well established careers. They also had to consider the future of their other two sons, Rainer and Michael, who were 8 years old and 3 years old at the time.
Annelize’s story of moving to the United States generally follows the same narrative as many other immigrants moving across with their families which is to hopefully create a better future for their children. After careful consideration and a lot of research, Annelize and her husband Jorg both agreed that they were willing to forgo their entire life that they had built in South Africa to move to the United States to ensure that their newly born child with Down Syndrome could receive the best possible care so he could potentially live an independent life one day. Annelize’s story is very inspiring and through the interview, is able to shed a lot of light on the perspectives of immigrants and how they perceive American society. She articulates very well the challenges of moving to the United States, the challenges of integrating into American society, and the psychological effect of becoming a naturalized citizen.
Analysis:
Theories of Migration
The decision to move to another country for permanent residence is no easy task. The amount of mental strength it takes to make a decision like that is very difficult for some, while for others, it’s the only decision that makes sense. Annelize and her family didn’t immigrate on a spur of the moment decision. There were many push and pull factors which helped make this decision very easy to make. Pull factors are the aspects about another country which makes it desirable to move there while push factors are aspects about a country that makes someone want to leave. After finding out their son had Down Syndrome, they spent a substantial amount of time researching countries that would offer the best quality of life considering their situation. Some of the pull factors which made her family decide on migrating were directly related to the push factors in South Africa. As she stressed many times, the primary reason that they moved to the United States was because their son was born with Down Syndrome. Therefore, the social services and programs offered to kids with disabilities in the United States was one of the biggest pull factors for her and her family. Consequently, one of the biggest push factors in South Africa was that kids with disabilities were an afterthought and the programs/institutions to help them live an independent life are much more difficult to access in South Africa. When their son was born, there were no hospital resources to refer them to speech therapists and other medical professionals who are experts in assisting children with disabilities. Another big pull factor for her and her husband was that they both were able to secure employment in the United States before they made the move. Secured employment made the move just make sense.
The time it takes for one to immigrate to another country can be quite substantial. This process can be even longer for those who are trying to immigrate with their family. It is also a very expensive undertaking. In the case of Annelize and her family, she estimated that it took over a year, closer to 15 months, for her to move to the United States with her family. This includes all the time from the day they decided to immigrate to the day they first stepped foot in the United States as future permanent residents. Even though 15 months may seem like a long time for a family to immigrate, it is actually quite short when compared to the story of others whose immigration process can take multiple years for it to fully materialize. 15 months in the grand scheme of one’s life though is still quite a lot of time. Not only did this decision take a long time to materialize, it was also a costly decision. She estimated that it cost roughly between $35,000 and $40,000 to immigrate to the United States. Annelize and her husband were both licensed pharmacists in South Africa. They were able to make the move happen quickly and swiftly because Rite Aid was recruiting pharmacists at the time in South Africa. As she talked about in the interview, Rite Aid took care of most of the documentation and legal paperwork to allow them to move and work in the United States. This means that they were fortunate enough to save some money on the legal expenses as Rite Aid had their own lawyers who took care of the processing.
Integration:
Finding acceptance in a new country is a challenge that every immigrant moving to a new country has to face. There are many stigmas in American society regarding immigrants as well as a lot of sentiments. There is also a lot of prejudice that immigrants will face throughout their whole lives. This is very ironic since America was first settled by immigrants and many American families can tie their roots back to immigrants from all over the world. In the case of Annelize, she couldn’t have imagined how easy and accepting her neighbors were when she moved to Virginia Beach. All the people that she met early on became lifelong friends and to her surprise, a lot of them were Americans and not immigrants like her. There was already an established South African community in Virginia Beach and a lot of them were also pharmacists that were recruited through the same program as Annelize and her husband. These positive initial interactions made adjusting to life in America a lot easier and also removed a lot of fears about being able to adjust.
Adjusting to the American pace of life can be quite an undertaking for many moving to the United States. The pace of life in America moves extremely fast when compared to many other countries around the world. This is very apparent in the work culture within the country. As Annelize talked about in the interview, she found it quite shocking just how many people have to work 3 jobs just to make ends meet in America. She also found it shocking just how many workers are employed part time and not full time. She recognized that this is as a result of Virginia being a right to work state which incentivizes businesses to employ workers part time since they aren’t required to grant benefits like dental and healthcare. Another big difference for her was the amount of hours one was required to work a week and how difficult it was for full time employees to receive time off. America has one of the most highly competitive job markets in the world and as a result, it is also one of the more stressful work environments when compared to other developed countries.
Moving to a new country obviously presents itself with a lot of new challenges and obstacles. One of the biggest challenges for a lot of people moving to a new country is culture shock. In the experiences of Annelize, some of the biggest shocks to her were centered around food and the cost of living in the United States. As she talks about in the interview, fresh produce in South Africa is much cheaper than processed foods and a lot easier to get as well. When she moved to the United States, one of the first things she noticed was that it was quite the opposite in the United States. Processed and frozen foods were a lot cheaper than fresh produce. She also noticed how it was more difficult to get fresh produce at affordable prices. This is obviously due to the fact that America is run by big corporations which have made it possible to get every household item you need at one store such as Walmart. It is also a result of the United States being so large in area but not as condensed as other nations such as South Africa.
Membership:
Personal identity is a huge aspect of a person’s life and it can become very hazy for a lot of immigrants as they begin to see the cultural challenges of living in a different country. Becoming a citizen in a new country is a life changing decision. A huge part of citizenship is immersing oneself in the culture of the country they live in and this can be very challenging for immigrants who have culture values which contradict that of America. A lot of immigrants as a result live a dual identity where they interact very differently at home with their family compared to them interacting with other Americans.
In the case of Annelize, she said she felt immense pride when she took the oath to become a naturalized citizen. And now that she’s a citizen, she feels no different than any other American citizen. She has visited South Africa about 5 times since moving to the United States and every time she goes back home, she says that she can gradually feel that she’s becoming more American with each visit. She also sees America as home because when she leaves South Africa to go back to America, she knows that she is going home. Even though South Africa is where she grew up and a huge part of her identity, she is comfortable knowing that America is her home now. That hasn’t stopped her from still continuing with her South African traditions and still living by the morals that she was raised with in South Africa. She may still talk with a South African but she now feels immense pride when she’s able to tell people that she is an American citizen.
Immigration Interview Transcript
Interviewer: Rainer
Interviewee: Annelize
Rainer:
Correct, I think, I have it working, okay, we can begin. So Hi, Mom.
Annelize:
Hello! Rainer!
Rainer:
Can you state your name for the video. So everyone can know who you are
Annelize:
Yes, so my name is Annelize, Getzschmann.
Rainer:
Thank you and obviously you’re an immigrant, because of this Project and I’m just going to ask you some questions regarding your trips to the United States and Life in the United States, and Compare it back to Life in South Africa so to begin first, question is, when did you move to United States?
Annelize:
So we moved in 19, Sorry in 2009 sorry about 14 years ago, we moved here. And um, And and it was in actually in July, in 2009. We moved, here.
Rainer:
Okay, so like around July, July, fourth or?
Annelize:
It was actually just before the Fourth of July. I think around this first of July. We moved to the US.
Rainer:
Very cool. And who did you come across with
Annelize:
So we left South Africa. We had a son, Rainer Getzschmann. He was about 9 years old, he was born in 2,000, and we had his brother. He was 3 years. Old, he was born in 2,006. And then, yeah, she was born in 2,000, and it was about a year and a half. And then my husband as well, so we had 5, in the family moving across. Was no family here in the US. We just came up as a single family on our own.
Rainer:
And how long is that flight?
Annelize:
So in total probably about 20 hours, the direct flight is about 16hours, from Atlanta to South Africa. But then, you still have another. Flight from Atlanta to Norfolk, or to Richmond. We actually flew in via Richmond due to the fact that our flight, was the light. Or we must our connection, flight from Atlanta to Norfolk, so we need to add, to Richmond
.
Rainer:
So that’s a long flight, and did you bring any other things with you?
Annelize:
So our immigration was pretty well planned. We immigrated with basically everything that we had in South Africa, with all our belongings that we own at that stage, the only thing that we Couldn’t bring was any, electronic state, to the fact that you have the front connections, here, then in South Africa and Different Voltage. so we can, with all our belongings, all our furniture. We had a container fully packed with everything that we had in the house, but that arrived quite a bit later than when we arrived so when we arrive we just each arrive basically with 2 suitcases with Glowing and a few toys for the kids that they were familiar with and we had to have. Probably different clothing. I think if I can remember well at that side as well, because we were going. From winter there to summer, year, end, of summer, or mid summer, and we knew we were going to go close to winter. So most of the clothing came with. But that was basically it. And we write it for our furniture, to arrive for the content
Rainer:
Hmm, where do you guys move to?
Annelize:
So we move to Virginia Beach before we came. We looked, at different areas. The city where we initially wanted to go was Charleston, South Carolina, but I didn’t have at that stage Positions for both of Us, available as pharmacists, so we decided to go to another coastal City which was Virginia, beach and then we inv basic. Identity before we arrived, to make sure that we will be happy in this and that it’s very similar to South Africa, and the fact that it’s a very international city, might it’s. Very easy for us to email, correct to this area. And then we settled in Virginia Beach, and we’ve been here for about 14 years. Now
Rainer:
And so you said you had other options, and what was your job in South Africa? Because you said something about ride, aid.
Annelize:
Yeah, so in South Africa, we were both were qualified as pharmacists, but neither of Us, work, as pharmacists and set Africa, at the time that we moved, we were in the beginning both of us, worked in retail in pharmacy, but then we started mail order company. So my function in South Africa was more as managing the Company and doing a lot of the marketing and business Strategy, and a Lot of Client lies in and my Husband Strategy, was oh, He’s Work in South Africa was more on the financial Side, of the Company, as Well as Logistics, recording the form of Circles, due to his background, and he the fact that he’s he worked actually in manufacturing, and South Africa. As well. And pharmacy. So, and why we came across as pharmacists, or how it happened was right. I recruited from us at the time we our youngest was born. And our youngest was born with down syndrome and that might us realize that it’s probably South Africa probably would not be the base place for him to grow up in we would prefer him to grow up in an area where spatial needs do not have to go to a special Needs school and America had far More inclusive schooling than South Africa could offer at that stage, and that’s why we decided to come to America. We looked at other countries. As well, we did look at Europe. Germany, Australia, but they were quite a few negatives with those countries on the base option for us. At that stage across America, to immigrate, to, and especially America’s. Schooling the fact that it offers so much we’ll start it in inclusive schooling was a very big plus for us, so right at that stage when Jens was born coincidentally, right I did a lot of recruitment for Performances in South Africa, so it was a quite An easy option for us, we both. Went for interviews, received our appointments, however, we had to do quite a lot of extra work or Numerous exams before we could even come across and so it was quite a long Project, we both had to write Exams prior to even being able to be signed up. By right, we had to do what we call a say. Fpga exam. Which takes your basic knowledge on pharmacy, science, mess Chemistry, and we had to boss that before we were even eligible. To come across as pharmacy interns to us with Friday. So, quite a long, process. So, on that’s how we decided to come across. We pause, the extent and got appointed by a rite aid, that they interview with them and time to choose. Is it the way we wanted to come and live
Rainer:
So from the moment you decided to move to the day you actually set foot in America, how long would you say that time took?
Annelize:
That was let me say Jens was born in January of 2,008, and I’ll think by about February March 2,000, and 8, with my decision to Immigrate and We started Doing all the Work and Arrangements, and We Immigrated by July so more Than a year. Oh, it’s about 15 months, at least, 1516 months before we were successfully in the United States
Rainer:
And I guess, including also, then all when you, test, you how to write and all that kind of stuff, and including the legal documents and all that business. How much do you think it cost you in total to move?
Annelize: In, total to move. Including legal, these 2, Probably close to 15 to $20,000
Rainer:
And does that also include the flight?
Annelize: So we were very lucky with a flights ride sponsored us initially to go right out exams in Chicago, when they initially interviewed Us, but we still had to write the Fpga exam I Sponsored us for those Flights, for both of Us. And they also sponsored us to come across to the Us. As a whole family, that paid for every child’s Flight, and both our flights. Which okay, so that $20,000 probably does not include the initial feature. That would have been another at least $10,000, just for the move across, at that stage.
Rainer:
So probably close to about $30,000. Then
Annelize:
At least
Rainer:
That was it. That was 2,009 $30,000 in 2,009
Annelize:
Yes, and that wouldn’t have been the legal that that wouldn’t have included our eventually our green card, the fees for the green card that wouldn’t have included our face. For our citizenship that was another but it there, I don’t know the exact, but probably at least another $5,000 I would think for those fees and legal Fees. As far as I can remember.
Rainer:
So in total, then you would say it’s around closer to 35,000 for the move
Annelize:
Yeah, probably $35,000. For a family, of 5,
Rainer:
Would you and would you have considered moving to United States? If you did not already have a job secured
Annelize:
No, never! Never! That’s not something. You do at our age, and it’s not something, it. If you’re young, and you don’t have a family. That’s a very easy move. To do but what? But even then even if you don’t have a family, it’s still a expensive move, so you have to immediately either start with help from citizens. Here or other South Africans, here or at least get a job very soon. But for us, with a family and 3 children. I don’t think we ever would have done it without job, security, no no question about it. We’ve wanted to do it
Rainer:
And were there any drawbacks that made you consider staying in South Africa?
Annelize: Here there’s a quite a few things that you realize that you’re gonna leave behind. You’re leaving behind your culture to a large extent you’re believing behind all your friends, all your family, which is pretty big and the way of how you used to loving in a country, and you’ve got to come to a country, where you have to learn everything all over again, get to know people mike. New Friends. So it’s definitely not an easy task to do that it’s not everybody is successful in that move and not everybody would be willing to do that, and especially with the fact that we had to rewrite all our exams, and gesture, stringent, in internship and very hard and difficult exams and I have to re-study everything all over again, as pharmacists, like every other pharmacy, student here, in the United States would do, and at our age with 3 kids and an international move definitely not an easy task and not something anybody would do so we had to do a lot of research. Before we just saw it. With kind of do. That and we definitely had to have a lot of mental strength to be able to get through all of that and still pass as pharmacists, and then start as pharmacist in a new country so a lot of factors that could have been negative but we definitely had enough reason, to move
Rainer:
So obviously then you didn’t have any issues securing a job in the United States?
Annelize:
No, so we were appointed as far as it’s already ahead of time, while we came across as pharmacy interns. But we knew we once we qualified, once we posted our exams. We knew we would be formless, as we are job security full on job security. Yes.
Rainer:
So you guys went from being ahead of a company in South Africa, to becoming an intern to make the move happen
Annelize:
Yes, so the reason and that’s. Why, what I would say to everybody that decide to move to another country, you have to have enough reason to move to that country, not everybody can make a successful move. And if you’ll reason it’s not good enough. You will not be secure in the move, and you’re probably gonna eventually go back to the country where you came from. We had enough, reason and that was our son with down syndrome. That’s really needed, we felt. It is important for him to have as normal life possible. And we knew it was not that possible in South Africa. We knew we had to leave the country in order to make that possible.
So we have had a pretty good reason. So yeah, we decided to leave everything. We had, a very successful both of us at very successful Careers at that point. Very successful company, But yeah, if your reason is good enough, you will do a lot. To us accomplish that motivating factor. What might you to move
Rainer:
So so how you envisioned America? Has it played out the way you used to view it in your mind, or the move across
Annelize:
What was differently for us, a little bit shocking in America was the expense of it. It’s not inexpensive to live in America. So initially, we thought comic across Us. 2 pharmacists, probably one of us would not even have to work, but it’s definitely not locked that office experience for a America so in that sense we didn’t think it would be this explains of to love here but on the other hand. It’s probably very close to what we thought it would be. We did a lot of research before we came across We did have already frames who left here in the Us. And we could speak a lot to them. So that’s probably very important for people before they come across as definitely talk to people who live here, make sure what the experiences is gonna be make sure what you’re dialing living is gonna be what what’s it gonna be like to left there well, the kids Adapt. Is it easy for us to adapt, and we had enough frames that we are already as form assist. Who could give us a lot of information about living in the country, and about work in the country. So you’re probably not too much of a surprise, because we did a lot of research before we came across
Rainer:
So how easy was it integrated into American society?
Annelize:
Integrating was not a difficult. Task. If you mindset, that’s right, that’s a pretty easy task. How ever. We were very lucky and very blessed that we made very good frames very early on in our move, a lot of them, Americans, but then we also have a very good they was a very Stable and a very big group of South Africans already. Living here in Virginia beach what all. Some added, very easy for us. Is the fact that Virginia beach is such an accommodating city. City. Do, to the military That’s here already a lot of NATO people coming here. So it’s a very multi-cultural city to love. In so it’s very easy to adapt due to the fact that the city is already so accommodating to internationals moving to the country. So not a difficult move and not definitely to establish yeah, in the Us.
Rainer:
So do you think then it would have been more difficult to settle in a city. Where most of the population is fifth generations, American
Annelize:
Yes, I definitely, think it would have been much more difficult In fact, a fear of frames. So also came across this form, assisted in up and cities like that, and that really battled to Adapt to the Country to my Good Frames very Isolated, difficult to foot into the Community so big that difference for them, versus how we had it make me just I think my phone Battery might go low let me just go get a Charger and just charge, my phone quickly.
Rainer:
That is all good. Okay, Well, if you can still answer questions. what are some of the biggest living differences between South Africa, and America.
Annelize: Big thing would be I mean the basic, things actually, not big differences, but bicycle differences would be Call culture, food. Schooling is different university, tertiary education is different. For kids, work. Environment is definitely different in South Africa, just on a work label. We had South Africa is much more like Europe You have 4 more, Lee, for example, Simon’s Europe, I’m trying to think big difference was for example, things that never close one. Once you love your in the States. You don’t really realize it, but Like in in other countries, your shops close earlier in the evenings, you don’t have this night life that nothing ever stops and everything continues forever. However, that changed a lot with Covid, now America’s. Far more like other countries, off the Cover due to the fact that we close now Shops And Businesses much earlier, let me try and think so I’ve talked about schooling the Tertiary, education.
Rainer:
Explain the work, culture, or the difference in work, culture. As you were saying, you get far more leave in South Africa, and countries in Europe compared to America.
Annelize: 00:23:17.000 –> 00:23:18.000
Yeah. So would you say it’s a better work call here, or or worse.
We’re, We’re We’re culture. I would say definitely not as easy as in other countries. I do think it’s. Yeah, I always, thought I looked very hard in South Africa. And when I came to America, I realized I’m like. This is for for harder, You look at the average person in America, does, for example, about 3 jobs just to be able to Michael living America, a lot of people are not appointed as full-time, so that I don’t get any full-time Vina efforts, which is very different from other countries. Especially in Europe, and South Africa. Most people there get full time appointments. Here, you, the big thing that was very different, for me. I I have never worked in a situation, or never had. Stuff, Where the Staff’s Hours can change from week to week, depending on how much work, is the viable to be done, for example, in a pharmacy depending on the amount of Scripts you, do for the week, that’s the hours, you have available for stuff for the next week, so I thought that Was nothing like that Europe is also not like that your staff would know from weeks I would know on a monthly basis, or actually on an annual basis.
What kind of hours I will be working, and it never differs so you don’t have the part time shifts that we have here.
And that was a big adjustment, and especially for to put my head around that I never thought it would be done like that in other countries, and that’s probably because of labor laws here, being so different, it’s more a right to work state people can get fired much faster year than and South Africa and South Africa to get somebody fired orifier somebody types far more intense License for that stuff, Member, lawyers get involved. You cannot. Just because somebody is not doing this job properly, or even when somebody committed safety in a company, it’s far more difficult to latest off member, call We’re here, a person, can go from one die. To a mix, and not have a job the next step. So for different work, culture here in the Us, then in other countries, and especially experience in South Africa, yeah, it’s I think it’s much more fun that for the company, than for the Employee, I Don’t think in the Us, we look as much after our employees, as we do and other countries.
Rainer:
So do you think then you could potentially run a business in the United States? Or would you ever be interested in running a business in the United States?
Annelize:
If I came across at a younger age. Yes, I definitely would have considered it. But looking at the h I am, and the security. We probably need at this age. I definitely will not consider it now, and especially not on pharmacy. Due to the fact, that pharmacy has had so many changes through the years, and it changes from year to year And with a lot of the especially with the Pbms and the insurance companies being very stringent, and very selective over good I allow to Dispense the Medications and That’s as well in Pharmacy why a Lot, of the Moment Pop Shops have closed It’s Just a Difficult to That’s a very
Competitive environment. And yeah, if I would have had to start a pharmacy business, no, not in the Us not at this state, might be another business, but The markets, we come in a very insecure market. When home prices were very low and not a lot of a lot of people were retrenched just before we arrived.And it’s not 10 years afterwards, and that’s very insecure the markets. Again we’re going into a recession pro. Possibly so again. Now that we are well established, the markets have done. That I don’t think it’s a good time now, to open up a new company
Rainer: And you said that food was a big difference, too. Can you elaborate on that? A bit more
Annelize: 00:28:29.000 –> 00:28:39.000
Yes, so it sounds, it might sound very stupid to a certain extent, but your taste buds are very different. When you arrive it takes quite a while for you to get used to certain ties here in America, for example, Bread was a very different very different for us. Here in the Us. Everything was much sweeter, all the food and spices are much sweeter, much more sugar, added to a lot of the spices, and Yeah, we had our T spots definitely had to change through the time. The culture of food is also different. Here everybody is far more into false foods for us, even the pricing when we purchase food initially, when we came to the Sites Pricing was much higher for False Food or for for fresh Fruit and Fresh Fruit and Vegetables, then you would buy for example, for fast food, which is unlike in South Africa, Fast food and Frozen Foods are much more expensive than fresh fruit and frigates.So that was something to get used to cause. We were used to clicking our own food in South Africa, which we continue to do here on the Us. So we still, not big Fast Food Eaters so the type of Food is different. But yeah, the fact that we kept cooking our own food. Might, that part probably a little bit easier for us to adapt to Something that was very different for us here in the Us. Is, for example, the size and the proportions of food, much smaller Portions in other countries that you get soft also something that’s Interesting as the size of Drinks and the fact that you Can Refall Unlimited, and That’s, Unheard, of Another Country The size, Pure Size of the Containers. Where you buy food in These are the biggest we’ve seen in our lives. We never had such big cartons of Mulk, or containers of milk, coffee, everything you you just don’t buy the containers, like here in the us, in other countries, so that was quite an Unusual thing, for Us, a lot, more to choose from as well, a very big for variety, so that it might initially very difficult to go do shopping bicycle and just do basic shopping, the variety of the amount of Sources, and t a coffee and you actually went to a shop, and You don’t even know where to start because the
variety was so big
And yeah, it’s some of it is quite a bit.
Different from what we were used to. So we had to it was a lot of trial and error in the beginning,
You buy something, and you either like it, or you don’t need go.
For Something else. The next time
Rainer:
We’re we’re the city, designs, any different This city designs. Yes. So, for example, like communic or commuting and traveling and Stuff, like that, was it comparable to the United States, South Africa Or was it any different cause in your case. Europe you walk a lot more compared to other countries.
Annelize:
No, I would say South Africa is very similar to the us. We also travel majority by car, not a lot of in South Africa doesn’t have a lot of like in Europe, trains and underground trains. We don’t have that in South Africa either. So yeah, the the move to this, at the end specific to Virginia beach. Was therefore very similar, as what we were used to in South Africa. Very little difference. in fact, Virginia Beach is very similar to a lot of our cities in South Africa. If we would have moved to New York. That would have been a very big adjustment. The fact that you live there and smaller compartments and apartments and travel very little by car, mostly by Rile, or Trying Yeah, that would have been a very different vote. But Virginia Beach, very similar to South African service
Rainer:
So did you, did you feel a sense of warmth from the community? When you move to Virginia Beach.
Annelize:
Yes, we had very good experiences right in the beginning. When we moved across here. We had a lot of welcoming neighbors, And yeah, we were actually surprised by how friendly, oh, Niagara We’re now easy. Diver, to get along with and how helpful they were, especially when we moved in. So yeah, the friendliness Warming, welcoming and theizing experience, when we are raft. Yeah, very, easy, experience.
Rainer:
How often do people bring up your accent?
Annelize:
Every day. I get asked every day in my job. Where am I? From? What’s your accent? Where is that from everybody that meets me everybody. Ask where that’s in a shop where there it is in the Formacy. Everybody. Says oh, I love your accent. Please speak a bit more And where are you? From? That’s the first thing, and then when I sign from South Africa, and then the next question is normally, where in Africa is South Africa.And then I’ve got to explain where South Africa is
Rainer:
So you would say, not a lot of people in America know about South Africa. No culturally or geographically, where it is
Annelize:
Oh, yeah. Definitely, not a lot of people not and once you mentioned the word Mandela, then a few people would say, Oh, okay, I know. But a lot of people will still ask where in Africa, East South Africa, they don’t really know the Content as to What’s North and what South and they I them I know it’s somewhere in Africa but that aren’t nice exactly where in Africa it is. Another thing that I get asked in often is Why am I white. So a lot of people think I’m supposed to be black, coming from South Africa. And they know a lot, about the wildlife, all that I’ve heard about the wildlife, but that does. I cannot always comprehend it. A lot of people. Still, things, that we have what life walking in the streets. We definitely get that But it’s probably more to graphically, way, people are very ignorant as to where South Africa is located in Africa.
Rainer:
And do you find that personally offensive or do you find it more funny?
Annelize:
Probably more. Funny, and more I for me through the years that’s actually become a good conversation point, and a good way of Connecting with people, and to start, a conversation that’s I’ve actually enjoyed it more done finding it to face Stuff I I probably actually never found out of Fame stuff the only time, that
I really found it offensive or swing? Somebody ask me, can I please speak English?
And then I found a few times here in the Us.
Where the very much older Americans where they’ve asked me, can I please speak English?
Which I always thought I speaking English.
Rainer:
That’s that’s funny. So how how do the Social services compare? Cause.
Social Services in Terms of So For example, you, said your son has down syndrome. So can you allow me a bit more on the type of Quality and social social care, you get and stuff like that in education or the Differences.
Annelize:
Okay, so, yeah, so in South Africa, when you’re child, as special, needs it, goes to a special needs school, hey? There’s not a lot of A vulnerability in terms of special needs. Care, for example, when Yen’s Most diagnosed with down Syndrome in a Hospital, we had to Do all the Research, to find him, a Physical Therapist, and even a Speech Therapist at that Site because he Couldn’t Suck his Bottle, so we this feature of person to work with him, to getting to start sucking the bottle so that we could leave the hospital, so that we had to do our own research, go find a speech therapist, where I would believe if he was born in America it would have even been given to us by the hospital that Would affect services immediately invited where that was an absolute no known factory in South Africa to start with something that early also in terms of schooling, we would have probably had to do most of the research, most of the spare social therapy that he would have needed we would have done all the research. In South Africa, where here it was given to us already immediately, we had to mic a few phone calls, and we are a speech therapist, coming out to ys once he started with school everything was available to us, he started with an IP, year which would not have happened in South Africa number one the fact that he is going here to an not to a special needs, school, but to an integrated school.
That’s already very different South Africa. You would have gone to and special needs school. Or we would have had a really big to ask a hate of us. If we wanted to same thing, to a regular scroll and that doesn’t happen very often in South Africa and here all the services are provided in school we have regular IP meetings specifically, to his needs here you have already speech set up us Ot Occupational therapists, and physical therapists. who are already involved with a school, and they are already form that already form part of the iep for the child. So very little work and research has to be done by the parents to find those therapies, because it’s already readily available for the child
Rainer:
And so. So. How long have you been living here in the United States?
Annelize:
14 years
Rainer:
Okay, and how how long ago did you get naturalized, become a citizen?
Annelize:
So I think we naturalized we we become probably about I think it’s about between 5, and 6 years ago.
Rainer:
Okay, so been a citizen for about 5 or 6 years?
Annelize:
Yes.
Rainer:
Okay, and When how how are you feeling? When you took the oath?
Annelize:
It was a very proud moment. It was obviously you don’t leave your country, where you were born behind, and it’s not like you ever gonna forget that country but it’s nice to be portfolio, part of America and to be seen as a citizen being able to vote, and just you just it’s just, a much more. It’s a much more warm feeling that you have.
So. Now that you finely a citizen in this country, you ask. There’s no difference now between me, and the next American I’m also a citizen of this country, so that’s a very warming feeling
Rainer:
So do you feel American. Now, then.
Annelize:
Yes, in fact, when we visit South Africa, we know when we leave it, we leaving to go home. So America’s definitely now home, to us, I don’t see South Africa as my home, anymore, at’s definitely America
Rainer:
How many times have you visited since you’ve moved to America
Annelize:
Okay, so 5 times. So I think I’ve said it, and total 5 times I think I’ve been back to South Africa it’s the pretty expensive process, and it’s very Expensive tickets the Flights are very Expensive so yards. It’s not that easy to also get long leave to make it worthwhile, to go to South Africa. It’s a very difficult process, just to get the leave to go and it’s expensive to go back
Rainer:
So so so when you do visit on average, How long do you have to stay to make the trip worth it
Annelize:
So when we first said, we try and start at least between 2 and 3 weeks. To make it worth the invasion to go across, and every time that we go for such a long period we have to get special permission from our companies to get that time, of leave available it’s not very often it’s most of us who are from other countries, who get that term off leave available for us to Go, visit out family, in the other countries.
Rainer:
And So every time you go back to South Africa, does it feel any different?
Annelize:
Yeah, it is you definitely realize every sound, that you got back.You realize that you are Less, part of that country, you. More, American, now, and when you go back to South Africa, it that has become, more for me, my visiting country and that’s also the changes that you see every time when you go back the Simus here in America where you have city’s going great bigger and more Neighborhoods, as the population is growing this time. We see in South Africa every time you go back, you see something new that you haven’t seen before and new neighborhoods. New Shopping scenarios, new boldings, there’s a lot of improvement there as well and There’s sometimes a lot of Change, as Well, not always Just Improvement, sometimes Things. Well, it’s not it wouldn’t be like that in every country, but South Africa seen a few changes as well in the country, that’s not as good as one would have wanted it to be
Rainer:
And so overall then would you say that your move was worth it.
Annelize:
Oh, yes, definitely.
Rainer:
Do you ever see your do you ever see yourself going back
Annelize:
No, we can see ourselves living there for a few months, just to be closer to our family, and to say our family, who’s there more often so once we retire probably one day we would go left there, for a few months, and come back, here and live, here but I don’t see myself going back, there.
Permanently no, our we live here. Now, our kids left here one day I will get married, and I will live here. Where they get so this is our new home country. So in our family, we were basically the first generation to move to another country. And this is the future for my kids, one day.
Rainer:
Well, thank you, I think I think we covered everything. Thank you for your time. yes.
Annelize:
Thank you. Have a good night.
Rainer:
Alright, you too, thank you
Annelize: Thank you, bye, bye
Rainer:
Bye
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