Interview with Linda
Introduction
When starting this project, I was not positive of who I should ask to be in the interview. I was not sure I knew many immigrants myself besides my grandfather immigrated to the United States a long time ago, but he passed away before I was born. I still turned to my mom to see if she knew any other relatives or friends that she knew that might have immigrated to the United States. She told me about her work friend Linda who moved here from South Africa. I have never met or talked to Linda before, so I went into the interview a little nervous as to how it would turn out. But after going through the whole process, the experience was very exciting and was nice just learning more information about the immigration process. Linda was an excellent choice for this project due to her detailed and expansive reasonings for all my questions. After talking to Linda before and during the interview, I became a lot more comfortable and the interview itself felt a lot more casual as it went on.
Methodology
I conducted the interview over zoom on December 6th around 9 pm. Zoom was a good choice for the interview considering Linda was in Maryland at this time and I was at James Madison University. Before the interview, I had a list of several questions I wanted to ask throughout, mainly what drove Linda to come to United States, the life and process of coming to America, and bringing up family. My questions were pretty straightforward, but throughout the interview and from Linda’s responses, I was able to ask a lot of smaller detailed questions which allowed the interview to feel a lot more casual.
The Experience in Durban, South Africa
Linda grew up in Durban, South Africa living a very happy childhood. Linda expressed how beautiful the city is and how she was just happy to be surrounded by family. However, Linda lived in Durban during the time of apartheid. Apartheid is a system of segregation and discrimination on grounds of race. Linda expanded on this explaining that the nationalist party at the time started apartheid and went into details on how there were eight-to-twelve-foot walls around every house due to rises in crime. Linda was part of the opposing party and did not stand for any of the politics and policies going on in the city at the time. This along with having children who she did not want to grow up in this climate led Linda and her family to immigrate to the United States when she was at an age of 32. Later in the interview, I asked Linda if she ever went back to Durban, which she stated that she did a couple times, and how the country has completely changed since she left when she was 32. She explained how Nelson Mandela completely shifted the policies and viewpoints of the city, where now the city sees much more equality, but still has a long way to go.
Immigrating to the United States
After the conflicts of living in Durban, Linda said she came to the United States with her husband and three children in 1985, along with her sister immigrating to the United States a couple years before her. Linda expressed how her life did not change much coming to the United States, and how there was not much of a cultural shift adjusting to life here. Linda also said how she came to the United States twice beforehand and hired an American lawyer to help do things the right way coming here, along with her husband finding a job as an architect. One difficult thing Linda and her family ran into though was the fact that they could not get all their money out of Durban, and how the exchange rates lost them around 80% of their overall money. Linda said the main reason she did end up choosing the United States was because her sister chose to live here first, she stated that wherever her sister went she would also. Linda expressed the importance of family and how important it was to stick together. Her parents would eventually move to the United States also, where they all live close together currently.
Life in the United States
When Linda came to the United States in 1985, she moved to Baltimore where she still lives to this day. When she first came here, Linda lived in a little row house for 23 years and had another child. Linda went into details on how the biggest focus for her coming to the United States was helping her children settle and move to a new school. Linda even said how her one son got down his American accent in one week. Linda said that her children all attended University and scattered across the country, some having their own children. After 23 years, all of Linda’s children moved out, where she would eventually buy a house, saying it was a peaceful area. I asked Linda if she planned on staying in Maryland, which she said she still wants to stay close to her sister, and her mom also moved in so for the time being, they will stay and take care of her. I asked Linda what career she has been in her life, which she talked about being a teacher. Even before coming to the United States, Linda taught in South Africa, and since has had a couple teaching jobs in Baltimore. She said she taught children with developmental and physical problems. Linda currently works at a preschool where my mom also works. Linda said that she does love being in this country and how they traveled a bit, she just hopes the US sorts itself out politically.
Conclusion
While I ended up giving a quick summary of Linda’s life, the biggest thing I took away from her story is her commitment to keeping her family together. Throughout the entire interview Linda just stated that she wanted what was best for her children, and how she would follow her sister wherever she went. She also said the hardest part about leaving South Africa was leaving her parents behind. The story ends nicely though, where Linda and her family ended up all living in the United States, where they all seem happy with where they currently live.
Grayson:
Okay. So I’m just going to start off with, where were you originally born?
Linda:
I was born in South Africa in a city called Durban, which was, uh, on the east coast. So beautiful city, right on the beach.
Grayson:
Okay. Uh, what is the country like?
Linda:
the thing is that the country, when I left the country, it’s completely different now. And that’s the reason we left the country. We left the country during the time of apartheid and it was just an incredibly, uh, difficult, uh, time to live. we went back about two years ago and things were so much better for so many people, but then for some people things hadn’t changed at all, which I guess is kind of, the way things go. But I mean, I, I had a great life. It’s a beautiful. Sort of exquisite coastlines, game parks. But then I had a white skin, so everything was, uh, fine and dandy for me. But if you had a black skin, then things were pretty horrific, and that’s how we left it.
Grayson:
So, uh, oh, sorry. Did you wanna say something?
Linda:
the change now is, after, Nelson Mandela came into power. He was the president of the country and he was absolutely amazing. I wish he was still alive. He just was awesome. He wanted freedom. He wanted. everybody to have a chance. He wanted just the fact of, of your, the color of your skin being so important.
He just wanted to dissolve all of that. Yeah.
Grayson:
so what was your experience like growing up? Like what was your family or school like around at that time?
Linda:
Well, I had a very, very happy childhood, my sister and. Lived with my parents in Durbin, which is a beautiful city. And, you know, as, as white people, we had a great life.
We, my father was a principal. So we just grew up very happily with family there. we had a good life except that we didn’t, we were the, uh, Democrats in South Africa. They, it was called the Progressive Party, and the other party was the nationalist party, and they were the ones that started apartheid. and that was, you know, Grayson, that was so cruel. Yeah, bet. I dunno. It really was, it was terrible. So I always, I had a very, very happy childhood, but I was very aware, um, I mean, my father used to sit at our Sunday lunch table. And always talk about immigration and we would be going to Australia or wherever we’d be going. but finally it took us to move to this country and then two years later, my parents followed us.
Grayson:
So I was gonna ask, when did you immigrate to the United States? Like how old were you? Also about
Linda:
- I had three children, uh, seven, five, and two. So in 1985 we came here. And the hard part, it, it wasn’t so much a cultural difference for us. Life didn’t really change that much. Except, Grayson, we thought we were coming to quite sort of a, a progressive and liberal country, and I have sort of, um, I warned your mom. I said I am a political person, so please tell Grayson before he interviews me. I, but things seem to have sort of changed, I think. Downhill somewhat politically. Yeah, yeah. we got a lawyer. we had been here twice beforehand. My sister came here. They came on a, a job opportunity about five years before we did. So you might ask why the United States. Well, I actually came because my sister was. If my sister had been in Australia, I probably would’ve gone there. But we are a very, very close family and I just needed to be with family. And I think that’s what kind of saved me because it’s very hard to immigrate. Yeah.
Grayson:
I was gonna ask, like why you decided to come to the United States, but it seems like you just answered that. So did you just come with your sister or did you come with I came with, you mentioned you come with your
Linda:
No my husband and I, my sister was here. She had been here for five years in Baltimore. Um, and so I had three children at the time and we came here. Sort of came here through the airport. My kids were young enough, they had to put their little thumbs and ink to stump, you know, just to record that they were entering the us.
Grayson:
Yeah. What was the legal process like coming here? Like was it challenging, like easy?
Linda:
it was challenging in that bit easier for us, to be honest, because we had white skin. and we had the money to, hire an American lawyer and she helped us do it the right way. You know, we didn’t sort of have to, we weren’t, we weren’t particularly fleeing the country, but we were leaving because things had become pretty hot. Yeah. and I couldn’t, I couldn’t imagine bringing up my kids there in that sort of climate. So as far as the sort of immigration part of it, it took about a year and a half year and three quarters to get here. My husband had a job. You had to have a. And on one of our visits here, he found a job and they, he’s an architect and they promised to keep the job for him. So that was good. The worst part was leaving my parents at the airport. I died.
Grayson:
Yeah
Linda:
Yeah, I bet. I think, um, your mom always just tells me, , her boys are everything to her, and my sister and I were just everything to my parents and, and that was, uh, devastating. To leave them. Yeah. Never. But I felt I had to because I had three kids and I needed to get them, uh, into a safer environment. I thought it was all going to blow. I did, I really did. We thought that there would be, um, sort of a blood bath, you know, there in, in Durban this beautiful city. Beautiful. If you were black, you could not live inside the city unless you had a special pass because you worked for somebody and. So people had to leave their children and family on farms and sort of outside of the city and then live in Durban or whichever city it was. I can only imagine. Uh, terrible. That must be, yeah, that sounds have to be with
Grayson:
Yeah, for sure. Like that’s just, I can’t even like imagine that. But do you, do you remember like the emotions or like mindset you had coming to the United States? Like, were you excited or like scared?
Linda:
I was a little bit of both. I don’t think, uh, at that stage so much excited because. It’s such a big thing, you know, to, at that time we, we couldn’t get our money out. It was frozen and the rate of exchange was like, it used to be $1 equaled, one rand, which is South African currency, and when we left it was like $1 equals 20 cents. So basically we lost, uh, probably about 80% when we eventually did bring our money over. It’s, I guess it’s scary. I knew I’d been to Baltimore twice and, and my sister was here, which was huge. We stayed with them for three months and. , but just not knowing anybody, you know, uh, leaving your country behind is very difficult, leaving family. My husband, mark left his whole family behind and, uh, we felt a bit guilty and so, yeah, I felt really guilty leaving my mom and dad and they had nobody. yeah,
Grayson:
What, what was the area you moved to coming to the us? Like did you start in Baltimore or did you
Linda:
I did. We’ve only been in Baltimore. We,
Grayson:
and you’ve stayed there ever since?
Linda:
We, here we, we lived in an area called Rogers Forge. I dunno if you know that it’s sort of, Near Stoneley. Near Towson. Yeah, And we lived in a little row house for 23 years and then when I was here I kind of had another baby, sort of just unexpectedly surprised. So my first, uh, American citizen was born and his name was Peter. And then after 23 years, uh, my kids were gone. They were all in university or they’re in New York. We actually bought a house, sort of outside, uh, in Pikesville in Acre, just away from everything. Which is cool. Yeah, like it’s very peaceful. Lots of trees, lots of grass. I didn’t see my neighbors very much, which is fine. just, it’s just peaceful, which is what I sort of crave.
Grayson:
What are, what are your thoughts on like the Maryland area? Do you like, enjoy living there? Do you plan on like staying or like moving?
Linda:
I think I will in the near future stay, I want to be close to my sister. She’s about five minutes away. Um, all my kids are gone. One is in Florida, the other’s all, all around. sort of New York City, sort of outside of the city. Um, Martin’s been still working. He hasn’t retired. I still want to teach. I love teaching, so I don’t have any plans to move. And my mother lives with me. She’s quite elderly. She’s 95, and I take care of her so for the time being, we, we are here. .
Grayson:
And does your sister, like plan on staying here also or does she also have other plans to like move or anything?
Linda:
She doesn’t have, she really doesn’t have other plans. Um, her one child is in California and she loves California and we both hate the winter. Yeah. Oh my God. I hate the winter , I’m a sun loving person, you know? But, Yeah.
Grayson:
I guess you kind of already answered this, but just I guess in general, like what’s the experience like going through like a transition to like a different country?
Linda:
For me it was, um, you know, I guess the first thing for me was helping my children settle and, and, and move into a new school, um, Rogers Forge Elementary. Um, and just watching them, they actually did it really. My, my one son who is very good with languages, he became an actor. Um, he had the American accent down in one week. He was more American than you are . It was so funny.
Grayson:
I believe it ,
Linda:
and now when Simon speaks to me without realizing, he actually speaks the way I. and he doesn’t even know that he changes accents. And when he speaks to his wife and his kids, then he’s American, which I find, um, funny. It took me a while to make friends. You know, I, I was pregnant. Um, it just sometimes felt, uh, pretty lone. I, you know, it’s just, it’s, it doesn’t, I mean, we were lucky we were coming to this country. There’s so much, and at that time it was just so much safer for us. My children could, uh, run up the road and visit my sister, but. in South Africa at that time, you couldn’t do that. I wouldn’t let my kids just run up and down. Um, the sidewalks, it wasn’t safe. Um, so there was a whole lot more freedom and there still is if you go, we went back two years ago and, um, , even though there’s a lot of very good change, it’s, there’s like a whole new middle class of, of person. Um, every single house has got like an eight foot to 12 foot wall around it because the crime is really very bad. and I just think here, we just walk along the road. I mean, there aren’t walls and gates and like you have there. So I mean, I love this. I love being in this country. It’s beautiful. We’ve traveled a little bit. Um, I just hope it sorts itself out politically, that’s all.
Grayson:
Yeah, especially recently.
Linda:
Particularly recently. Absolutely.
Grayson:
Um, so what, what has life been like in general since moving? Like what jobs have you taken, have changed, have things changed since you first moved? I know you kinda said the politics has changed, but, um, just anything else.
Linda:
I am a teacher by training. I taught in South Africa, so I’ve had a couple of teaching jobs here in Baltimore. Teaching, let’s see, sort of, uh, children with developmental problems or actually physical problems. I taught for five years at Riderwood Elementary and um, and now here I am in preschool and I love teaching preschool. I teach music and art. And it’s cool because I can be as creative as I want and, and that I love doing. I really get a lot of pleasure. Um, I’ve done a lot with music. I’ve written quite a bit of music and my, my kids are very musical. Um, we sort of form a little band and my daughter sings and I. And sort of have a little orchestra on my keyboard. So
Grayson:
what, what instruments do you play? Or piano. Okay.
Linda:
Piano. And, and I have this keyboard here so you can, it’s cool. You have garage band and, and you lay out different tracks.
Grayson:
So I do that and I’m also a musician at heart.
Linda:
you are? What do you. ,
Grayson:
uh, piano and drum. I’m trying to learn drums right now.
Linda:
Oh, cool. My son does drums too. Yeah.
Grayson:
Um, so have, have you, uh, returned to, um, South Africa? Since, since, or like visited since?
Linda:
Yeah, we went, um, we went twice, actually only twice, gosh, had been here along by 37. Well, uh, the first time was when it wasn’t a great trip. My mother-in-law was dying. We had to go and see her, but two years ago we took Peter, my youngest and his wife Helen and Pete’s American, born here, and he had only heard about. About ventures and everything we had done there, and so we took, they came with us and we went to Cape Town and it just was, it was so cool. He just felt that he was seeing. In effect that, that he knew everything that we were seeing because I had spoken about it so much. He said it was really quite surreal. We took him back to Durban and um, the Jaren spoke mountains, which are like the Rockies where I grew up, and that that was an amazing visit. The game reserve. They loved that. Oh my gosh, they loved that. But for me it was just so cool. Just seeing it was completely different. It South Africa has moved along so much in, in that, um, because of Nelson Mandela. You just see people with dark skins everywhere and living in cities and working and having jobs, and there’s so much more equality. And I found that that was awesome. But they have a long way to go.
Grayson:
Was that the first time you visited Aino said, or was that the second time?
Linda:
That was the second. The first was kind of the. but that was quite a long time ago that we went, but this last time, two years, just before Covid, before Covid hit. And that was wonderful except, except when I went to the house where I grew up and then my, the house where Mark and I got married, there were just these big walls with steel piles on the top. and I just couldn’t live there anymore, to be honest. I just couldn’t.
Grayson:
Do you have any plans on visiting in the future or anything?
Linda:
I hope so, yeah. Because Mark’s, Mark’s two sisters are still there. Um, yeah. Well, I, I’d love to take my other kids, you know. Sarah was two when we moved, so she doesn’t remember anything. And uh, Simon and Matthew, what were they? Seven and five. So I’d love, I will definitely go back at some stage. I haven’t got any plans right now, but definitely
Grayson:
because then you also said your uh, mother came to the US?
Linda:
Yeah. Two years after we did. My parents followed. And, and that was incredible cuz my dad was 70 and he lived with us. They lived with us for about three months. Um, and then they kind of lived where, I shouldn’t even say this, it took a while for them to get a green card. Um, so you. , they’re amazing because they left everything. And, and to start a new life at age 70 and 61, it’s quite hard. But they were awesome and our family was together, which was lovely.
Grayson:
So Awesome. . Mm-hmm. . Uh, do you have any plans for the future or you plan keeping things how they are?
Linda:
Right, do you mean as far as where we live?
Grayson:
Uh, yeah. Or just like career choices and like all that. Just everything.
Linda:
I want to travel. I wanna get out and go to Europe, go to Italy. I would love to do that. I think we are going to try and do that next year. It’s just a little difficult because my mother’s with me and her health is very, uh, precarious. So I’m very much a caretaker at the moment. Um, but I do, I would love to travel and there’s just so much to see. I have been to Europe, I’ve been to England. I actually lived in England for a year when we were. My father was a principal and he went from school to school, sort of, um, studying speech and drama. Yeah.
Grayson:
Well, I mean, that’s all the questions I have. Is there anything else you wanted to maybe say or ?
Linda:
I’m glad that we bought our kids. and, and obviously they’re all grown up now with families and children, um, because so many people immigrated, so many people. Uh, yeah. When we left, people called us, uh, rats leaving the sinking ship, but in a way, I think it was. , it was more courageous to leave than to stay. I don’t know. I, I just, I felt that, yeah. But I’m glad we did because so many families now of people our age, all their kids have left the country and they’re an Australia States or England. And because we did it when the kids were young, then at least we’re. in the us.
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