Interview with Patty Gray
On December 5th I had the pleasure of conducting an interview with one of my former neighbors and closest family friends, Patty Gray. Growing up our families did a lot together. We rented the same beach house, had family dinners and game nights, and her kids would often babysit me and my siblings. Patty was someone who always welcomed me into her home with open arms, but I never really had a conversation with her until now. I wish I did, though, as her experiences and perspective as someone who went through the process of immigration has given me insight that I likely never would have gained otherwise. I hope her story will be able to do the same for everyone who takes the time to read through it.
One of our beach trips (top left: Patty, next to Patty: Andy (her husband), bottom left and directly above: Patty’s two daughters)
Patty grew up in the capital of Colombia, Bogotá, with her parents and eight siblings. Both of her parents were employed and were able to provide a normal life for their children. She went to university to study English and engineering. It wasn’t until Patty was thirty that her friend invited her to the United States for a vacation. Since she liked it so much, and was looking for a change, she decided to come back and stay with her friend in California while continuing to study in English. From talking to her I noted that this was the main pull factor leading Patty to permanently reside in the United States. This differed from many of the accounts we learned about in class, as it didn’t have anything to do with economic opportunity, rather she initially came on a tourist visa. Reading through some of the theories of international migration summarized by Massey, her journey would be best explained by the social capital theory and the theory of cumulative causations. According to the former migrant networks are “sets of interpersonal ties that connect migrants… through ties of kinship, friendship, and shared community origins” (Massey, 43-44). The initial reason Patty was able to experience America was because of her friend who invited her for a vacation and later allowed for a much easier transition by offering a place to stay. It goes even deeper than that, though, as the friends and family of Patty’s friend also gave their support at various times during Patty’s immigration process.
Based on what she said it seems like the pull factors were stronger than the push in Patty’s case, but she did mention some issues in Colombia that weren’t as prevalent in the United States. As she mentioned while talking about what her life was like in Colombia, “there were some troubles, social troubles in Colombia, and the difference between different classes are very hard there.” From what I could tell this didn’t affect her family directly, so it wasn’t a major reason for her to leave and create a better opportunity for herself, but one of the reasons she did like the United States was an absence of the aforementioned problems. When discussing her motivations for leaving she says it was nice to not have to see “all these people in the street being homeless. Or the kids asking for money.” Her words here aren’t blaming the homeless or kids for being in the position they’re in, rather she was just giving examples that show one of the differences between Colombia and the US.
“Massel, Emily, and RJ Reinhart. “Colombians See Wider Divide Between Rich and Poor.” Gallup.com, Gallup, 23 Nov. 2020, news.gallup.com/poll/272324/colombians-wider-divide-rich-poor.aspx.”
After six months of living in California, Patty eventually found her way to Virginia where she met her husband, Andy. Andy also happened to be an immigrant (from England) who at the time was able to stay in the states on a work visa. This is something Patty listed as being a difference in difficulty for someone coming from Europe as opposed to Latin America. The company Andy was working for did everything for him in terms of ensuring he had his papers and documents in check, while Patty didn’t have that leisure. Luckily, she was able to get a job with the same company. The major difference between their experiences integrating, though, was the language barrier. Despite studying English in school, she was still not prepared to be surrounded by people speaking an almost entirely foreign language. She described it as being like “videos that you don’t know how to react to anything.” Other than sometimes being picked on for her accent, however, Patty didn’t have anything negative to say about the American people. In terms of how she interacted with others everything she said was overwhelmingly positive. “Whenever somebody asked me, “what did you think about Americans?” I always say very welcoming people and very generous.”
Patty and Andy’s marriage is just one example of the growing number of interracial couples in America. Their chance of meeting was heightened significantly with the 1965 Hart-Celler Act removing national quotas, resulting in the increased movement of non-white immigrants. I couldn’t help but think about the implications their relationship has on the reinvention of the color line in America as well. As Lee and Bean state there is a “question of whether today’s color line is evolving in new directions toward either a white-nonwhite divide, a black-nonblack divide, or a new tri-racial hierarchy” (p. 561). Obviously this one relationship doesn’t matter in the grand scheme of things, but I do think it is interesting to consider if Patty’s positive experiences as a whole could be related to broader social changes, such as Latinos being gradually accepted as “white” like European immigrants were decades ago.
Even though Patty always felt welcomed here, she recognizes that not everyone has the same experiences as her, and that people still hold misconceptions about immigrants that paint them in a negative light. Her opinions are consistent with much of what we learned in class about immigrants not stealing jobs from Americans, rather there is a demand for immigrant labor due to Americans not wanting to do certain jobs. She believes “in general, these people are very hard workers,” and are just trying to create a better life for themselves and their families. With regards to undocumented immigrants and DACA recipients her views are relatively the same. “I think those kids are really Americans. And I think they deserve to be here, because this is now the country that they know.” As an immigrant herself she can understand the circumstances and better empathize with those who are in similar situations as she was once in.
This was my first time doing an assignment like this. I thought it was really enjoyable conducting an interview and getting to know the story of someone I’ve known practically my whole life. There’s quite a bit I believe I could have done better, though. Going back and listening to the interview I realized that I sometimes asked multiple questions at the same time, and while it wasn’t my intention, I did occasionally frame a question in such a way that I was limiting the amount of answers the interviewee could give. Other times I would say things that didn’t actually add something of value but disrupted the flow of the conversation a little bit. For example, I would say “right” in agreement before they finished their entire thought. That was particularly annoying to have to listen to while I was editing the transcript. It was definitely a learning experience for me, and I feel more confident in my abilities to do something like this again in the future.
Bay Halloran 0:05
Does it say that it’s recording in the top left on your screen?
Patty Gray 0:09
Yes.
Bay Halloran 0:10
It does? All right. Cool. So it is December 5. I am interviewing Patty Gray, who immigrated from Colombia. All right. So, um, how old were you when you came here?
Patty Gray 0:28
30.
Bay Halloran 0:29
You were 30?
Patty Gray 0:30
Mm hmm.
Bay Halloran 0:31
Okay, so you lived a good portion of your life in Colombia?
Patty Gray 0:35
Yes.
Bay Halloran 0:36
What was that like, in terms of your experiences, your family, like the education you received? Your, your work? Anything related to that, that you would want to tell me about? How was that?
Patty Gray 0:49
Okay, I am from Colombia, a from Bogota, and I decided to come here after I graduated from University. I study English and engineering. And I have some friends here that invited me for vacations, and I came and I like it. And I decided to come back, I go back to Colombia, and I decided to come back to study English, because she invited me to stay here and live in California.
Bay Halloran 1:42
Gotcha.
Bay Halloran 1:43
What was growing up in Colombia like?
Patty Gray 1:50
I am from a family that I have eight siblings and my parents were professionals. My father was in accounting, and my mother was in (unintelligible – 00:02:02) and we have a normal life in Colombia. But of course, there were some troubles, social troubles in Colombia and the difference between different classes are very hard there.
Bay Halloran 2:28
When you when you came here was there anyone, you said your friend invited you to? So you could study English?
Patty Gray 2:37
Yes.
Bay Halloran 2:38
Were they the only person you knew coming here or was there other people that you came to the United States with?
Patty Gray 2:47
No, I just came by myself and she was my only friend. She have some family here. Some other sister. I know that but she was the only one that I was a friend of.
Bay Halloran 3:00
Okay. So she lives in Virginia I’m assuming?
Patty Gray 3:06
She was living in California.
Bay Halloran 3:08
California. Did you come to um, did you go to California first, or do you come straight to Virginia?
Patty Gray 3:17
I entered from Miami, and I fly to California.
Bay Halloran 3:21
Okay. How long did you live in California for?
Patty Gray 3:25
I think in California for six months, I think. Yes. And my friend has to go back to Colombia. So I went for a while to her sister house in Miami. And then a friend of her was living here. And I was thinking to go back to Colombia because I just speak Spanish in Miami. I was not doing anything. And I and a friend of her invited me to come here to Virginia.
Bay Halloran 4:02
Okay, so after six months of staying in California you came to Virginia?
Patty Gray 4:07
Yes.
Bay Halloran 4:09
And is that when you met Andy?
Patty Gray 4:12
Yes. So here I was living with an American family. And I met Andy and we said to them I, he came from England. And he was in process of immigration by a job. So they ask they require him to have the residence. And when we got married, we applied together and we and I got that residence with him. The US residence.
Bay Halloran 4:52
Okay. And then afterwards of course, you had Joanna and Nicole.
Patty Gray 4:57
Yes.
Bay Halloran 4:58
Started your family here with Andy okay, okay. When you left Colombia was there anyone you were leaving behind and like, sad to see , or leave them from? I’m sure there’s people that you missed when you left.
Patty Gray 5:17
All my family. My father, my brothers and my eight siblings, well seven siblings, because my sister was married with a German guy and was living in Germany.
Bay Halloran 5:32
Okay. And then how did you stay in touch with them?
Patty Gray 5:39
I travel also the (inaudible – 00:05:44) every two years to see them.
Bay Halloran 5:52
Would you say there was any struggles in kind of balancing having to learn an entirely new culture in America and like staying true to like your old culture in Colombia when you went to visit your family?
Patty Gray 6:10
Well, it looks like, it looks like you will want to do two places to live here. I feel like this is my country.
Bay Halloran 6:22
Right.
Patty Gray 6:23
This is my place. So I miss them and all that, but it’s like I have two places in the middle, but I feel like this is my place.
Bay Halloran 6:34
This is your place.
Patty Gray 6:35
Yes. I figure that and I always go to Columbia. And it feel sad to leave, but it’s like when you return home. Like that.
Bay Halloran 6:48
Okay. What were your kind of motivations for leaving? I know, you mentioned your friend. And you had an opportunity for more education. But were there also things happening within Colombia that were kind of pushing you to leave?
Patty Gray 7:09
Yes. I was personally I was looking for a change.
Bay Halloran 7:15
Okay.
Patty Gray 7:17
But I think here more opportunities and I like the security that this country have in that moment, not just economically, but socially. And I was looking for something like that. And when I arrived here, I did find that different. Of course, one day I was taking an English class with a private English class again, and I say here Englishman, and I say she asked me the same, “What do you like about America?” And I say I feel so much in peace I don’t see crime here I guess and she say, “there is crime here.” It was in the in the fun area. And she said, “two or three blocks from here, you have to be careful, because can have a lot of things.” But you don’t feel like you see here when I come thirty something years ago, lying, all these people in the street being homeless. Or the kids asking for money. That was so nice for me to see.
Bay Halloran 8:30
Right. Um, yeah, that is nice.
Patty Gray 8:37
Yeah.
Bay Halloran 8:39
Well, what would you say was kind of the most difficult part about leaving and coming as well like that whole process? What was the most difficult part for you and getting like settled down and stuff like that?
Patty Gray 8:49
Well, of course, I missing my family and everything was a big change for me. But the most difficult thing was the language.
Bay Halloran 9:01
The language.
Patty Gray 9:02
Yes, it is like feeling like, like, you cannot communicate and you cannot hear what people who say to you or it is so difficult. It’s like, like videos that you don’t know how to react to anything. Yeah, it is something like you feel so, “oh my gosh, this is really hard”.
Bay Halloran 9:30
I mean, I can only imagine how difficult that would be because I took Spanish classes in high school and whatnot. But it was never like I was surrounded by people that were speaking a foreign language.
Patty Gray 9:42
I took English all my school years and I think it was like nothing because the pronunciation everything is so you talk. When you talk a language you talk so quickly that the people that taught you didn’t understand because it’s like one more completely is very hard. Language for me was the hardest things. The people was very nice here in Richmond. I always found American people so kind to me and so generous. Whenever somebody asked me, “what did you think about Americans?” I always say very welcoming people and very generous.
Bay Halloran 10:22
Right. Yeah. Yeah, that’s a good thing about here. Especially Richmond I feel like it’s very welcoming. And then, throughout your journey what kind of like, what was, what were some unexpected things that like, or surprises that kind of happened that you were kind of taken off guard from a little bit because obviously somethings are to be expected, like having difficulty with learning a language or something like that. But was there, was there anything that kind of took you off guard?
Patty Gray 10:57
Yeah, was not easy for me. Actually was not, but in a silly way difficult when people say make fun about your accent.
Bay Halloran 11:10
Okay.
Patty Gray 11:11
It is a little because you feel like, okay, but you get used to it.
Bay Halloran 11:19
Right, right. Okay. Yeah, it’s probably pretty annoying. Um, yeah, I know. I know. Like, people here they probably you know, made fun of you or something for like being “too Colombian” or something. Did you? Did you ever get some of the same behavior from your family in Colombia for being “too American” or something? When you went to visit them?
Patty Gray 11:46
Yes. Because I have the problem. Now I mix the two languages. Yeah, I speak too much. I sometimes I speak to them in English. Come up in the culture you get changed. You get changed. You get different for many reasons, I think, and to live here by yourself and to, you grow up different you are not supported from a complete family every time and it’s very hard time to arrive here is hard, right here get the language and start to go on. It is, so it’s you see it I think that made the person different in some ways. And I feel sometimes that I’m so I grew apart from my friends and from my family, but I love them. And so many things. And I missed it a lot. In fact, many times I want to go in I feel that I need to go to them. But but you guys different.
Bay Halloran 13:02
Yeah.
Patty Gray 13:03
Yes.
Bay Halloran 13:05
Um, would you say that it’s kind of similar to, I know raising two daughters to be, you probably try to keep some of the cultural traditions from Columbia and pass them down to Joanne and Nicole, right?
Patty Gray 13:17
Yes, Yes, I do. And we have here what Andy’s from England. So we have these three cultures at the same time. But that, of course, I am myself and I cook Colombian food, the nice bit of Spanish all the time here. And of course, they I told the memories from my county and how it was when I was young and university. How different were the times and all that, but I see my daughters. They have the interest to know my culture.
Bay Halloran 13:57
Yeah.
Patty Gray 13:58
But maybe because they and they know my language, not their favorite they know. But I think for more for the language or something I see them more closer to Andy’s family.
Bay Halloran 14:13
Okay. Yeah, I’ll bet the language probably plays a pretty big role in that.
Patty Gray 14:19
Yes.
Bay Halloran 14:21
How would you say your, because Andy immigrated from England, right?
Patty Gray 14:26
Yes. From-
Bay Halloran 14:27
How would you say your experiences kind of differed and were similar to his?
Patty Gray 14:34
Oh, because he, he was so easy because immediately the company did everything for him. Doesn’t happen so easy for a Columbian because I have before I get an idea to work with this American family, in the company that he has, and they ask for a work permission for me, they work visa. But if I lose that job, I am without papers.
Bay Halloran 15:09
Right.
Patty Gray 15:11
So when I became the he came already with all the papers from his company, and they just put me when I get married in those in that application, and I get the paper. I think for European people is easier than from Latin American people to get the visa.
Bay Halloran 15:33
Yeah.
Patty Gray 15:33
And other papers.
Bay Halloran 15:34
For sure. Was that kind of a fear of yours that if you lost that job and didn’t have your papers, you might get deported?
Patty Gray 15:44
I have to go back if I don’t want to be here.
Bay Halloran 15:48
Mm hmm. And that was just never a concern for him.
Patty Gray 15:52
Yes. But I didn’t get immediately I got I got the application on so I didn’t have any portion illegal.
Bay Halloran 16:06
Right. Yeah, it’s pretty, it’s pretty nice that you met him and were able to like, get with that side of things. Um, let’s see here. Okay. So what would you say are some of like the, um, your sources of joy that you now experience from immigrating specifically that you wouldn’t have necessarily had if you had stayed in Colombia or something?
Patty Gray 16:40
Excuse me?
Bay Halloran 16:41
What would you say you’re, like, what made you happy or joyful from immigrating specifically that you wouldn’t have experienced if you had stayed in Colombia, or sources of joy unique to your experience as an immigrant.
Patty Gray 17:04
I have been more, I appreciate to be here more like in peace. When it changed to be for me all these at totally peace I feel here and so secure. But with the 911 it changed a lot in me, because I start to feel again, I am not so totally sure and secure here. But in general, I think that this is the aspect that I like the most. That I can go free here, walk around, and I am not afraid that somebody stole my bag. Things like that.
Bay Halloran 17:52
Right. So just that like feeling of security.
Patty Gray 17:55
Yes. Okay.
Bay Halloran 17:57
Um, yeah, that makes sense. And then and I know you mentioned earlier how you were saying how, how people would like, treat you different because of your accent and stuff like that. But were there any other things that made you feel unwelcome here as an immigrant?
Patty Gray 18:15
Not really.
Bay Halloran 18:16
Not really, um-
Patty Gray 18:19
Many friends had tell me I am feeling discriminated, or things like that, but honestly, I didn’t have that.
Bay Halloran 18:28
You didn’t have that experience.
Patty Gray 18:29
No, I didn’t have that.
Bay Halloran 18:31
Okay. Now that, that’s really nice.
Patty Gray 18:33
Yes.
Bay Halloran 18:34
Um, so when you, would you say you found a good sense of community here and a good group of people to be around to like, help you with assimilating into the culture?
Patty Gray 18:47
Yes.
Bay Halloran 18:48
You did feel welcome?
Patty Gray 18:50
Yes, very welcome.
Bay Halloran 18:52
Right.
Patty Gray 18:53
When I come and I ask all the other people of their culture, but maybe also true of my culture, and I didn’t feel afraid of me there. But in general Americans like I say to you are very generous and very welcome.
Bay Halloran 19:14
Okay, yeah, that’s nice. All right. Um, so okay, so I know you said you never really had that fear of being deported because you did have that sense of security with Andy and whatnot.
Patty Gray 19:34
As soon I because I have that. I didn’t have that because I have my work visa. First. I come with a tourist visa.
Bay Halloran 19:45
Okay.
Patty Gray 19:46
Get the work visa to this company. And then I applied for my residence when I get married. So I was always legal, and I didn’t have that insecurity I was going to be deported.
Bay Halloran 20:01
Gotcha. Was there anyone else you knew that was close to you that was deported or did you not have anyone like that in your experiences?
Patty Gray 20:14
No, I know many people got deported I was working in social services. I had a lot of cases that the husbands have been deported, but close to me I don’t know anybody that had been there deported.
Bay Halloran 20:29
Nobody close to you, gotcha. Which one would you say most of your friends, or did you have any friends that were also from Colombia or immigrated here that you were able to share your kind of experiences with? Or would you say you mostly made friends with you know, kind of people who were already like born here and stuff like that.
Patty Gray 20:54
I have friends from Colombia and most of the recent progress in Colombia is marry another Colombian but he’s as doctor, he studies here and it was similar the situation. She got married the same idea right? Got a job with the papers. In general, situations are similar to mine.
Bay Halloran 21:26
Gotcha. Okay. So is there ever like something like a unique to like your experiences with other immigrants that like you can like immediately, like feel a bond with them or a connection with them and have like a funny like, inside stories to tell about them that other people wouldn’t necessarily get or something like that?
Patty Gray 21:50
Well, because there are Colombians, I immediately get. I don’t talk about immigration.
Bay Halloran 22:00
Yeah, that makes sense. Why would you want to talk about how you got here when you could talk about all the things in your past country? Okay. Yeah. Um, well, so what were some of the, what are some of the cultures and traditions that you still try and work into your like American lifestyle I guess that you brought over from Colombia?
Patty Gray 22:23
More food. Yeah, we the tradition in Colombia the same all that year Christmas, New Year, Mother’s and Father’s Day, things like that. So not so different from here really.
Bay Halloran 22:46
So it’s mainly just the food pretty much.
Patty Gray 22:49
Yeah food, yes.
Bay Halloran 22:51
Do you did you enjoy kind of help letting other people experience the food of your of your culture? And like, experiencing the food here Maybe as well?
Patty Gray 23:02
Yes. And my family like it a lot.
Bay Halloran 23:06
They do. Which, which do you prefer?
Patty Gray 23:10
Which food?
Bay Halloran 23:11
Yeah, which food.
Patty Gray 23:12
American or Colombian? Both.
Bay Halloran 23:16
Both?
Patty Gray 23:17
Yeah, I think I am. Really, I find that and I mix in I cook both things and all that. And I think some things, I like something some here, and I like a lot of things from Colombia. And we like a lot of things from England to.
Bay Halloran 23:38
From India?
Patty Gray 23:40
England.
Bay Halloran 23:41
Oh, England.
Patty Gray 23:41
India too. My husband love Indian food.
Bay Halloran 23:45
Okay. Yeah, that’s pretty, that’s pretty nice you get to have all of three, I guess in the household.
Patty Gray 23:52
Yes. Yeah. We had like kind of open mind to cultures and all that. That is a big difference I think.
Bay Halloran 24:00
Yeah. Would you say that there that, like, your experiences with another country helps you be more open minded to other people and experiences?
Patty Gray 24:09
Yes.
Bay Halloran 24:10
Yeah. Because I know you said people here are welcoming as well. But I’d imagined that it’d be easier for you to see people and understand where they’re coming from kind of.
Patty Gray 24:21
And the situation that they are leaving and all that, the transition to be here is difficult and all that.
Bay Halloran 24:29
You said you’re in social work, right?
Patty Gray 24:33
I used to work in social work. Yeah.
Bay Halloran 24:38
What kind of got you into that. Did you just want to kind of help people with similar experiences kind of was it mainly focused on other immigrants or was it just-
Patty Gray 24:51
Yeah, yeah, I say the benefits. I was-
Bay Halloran 24:55
Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Okay, so what would you say are kind of your, I know immigrating is not easy in the slightest. So what would you say are some of like the moments that make you proud of what you’ve accomplished?
Patty Gray 25:16
Well, I think I think good, because I know many people I know many people that immigrated, so we say thinking about the country, where are they from missing their friends we see all the time, their family, the food a lot. I am not. I was very easy to go into the school today. I said what I have here, and I say, okay, when I can eat my, when I go to Columbia I eat my stuff and I love it. But when I come here, I have what I have here. So that is nice. That I can do. I am here and I am here in like, all and I think that this is this country has been wonderful to me and I have my family here. This is my home.
Bay Halloran 26:15
Mm hmm. And you’re proud to call it your home?
Patty Gray 26:18
Yes.
Bay Halloran 26:19
Right. Yeah. Okay. That’s good. So, what advice would you give now, to someone who, who’s trying to come to this country or just go through the immigration process in general, knowing what you do now.
Patty Gray 26:45
Well, if somebody say to me this moment, that I want to come, that wants to come here. I’d say I ask to them I talk to them exactly like how hard it is the first time and a lot. And I would like to say come with some English because it is so hard, it is even harder if you do not speak or understand. And think very well, if this is what they want. If they can’t really adapt to this culture, if they can, if they are not going to live their life thinking that they want to be in the other, in Colombia, for example. Because what I’ve seen is that you have to live where you want to be, with where you are happy. But if we are thinking that you were you just go like this, don’t like the people, don’t like their food, don’t like anything, if you prefer so I say you need to be there.
Bay Halloran 27:53
So just, so you’re saying just like, know what you want. And if you don’t, if you’re happy where you are, then stay where you are-
Patty Gray 28:03
Exactly.
Bay Halloran 28:04
Okay, that’s good. That’s good advice, I’d say. And then what did you think you had any kind of struggles raising kids as someone who wasn’t born in America and maybe had kind of a difficult time interacting with like their teachers and the parents of the kids in their classes and stuff like that?
Patty Gray 28:38
I don’t I don’t think, I think a little different feeling my kids from the other kids, maybe their culture some of that stuff, all that stuff. I have, I am not so how you say so socially involved.
Bay Halloran 29:03
Right, okay.
Patty Gray 29:04
So they did actually have culturally, have a problem. Instead of certain things, I feel difference if my friend is America or if my friend is Colombian. Easy to talk in your language is different that relation, you see? But I don’t have any problem with an American friend or anything like that or interacting with teachers or your people. I don’t feel any different.
Bay Halloran 29:41
Okay, that’s good. Would you um, would you say they kind of maybe had a different experience with parents who weren’t native born as opposed to other kids with getting along with them or something that I didn’t ever get like picked on or something because their parents aren’t from here. I know kids are weird like that sometimes.
Patty Gray 30:06
I hear something one day. One of my girls say that somebody called her Mexican. And I, I said that is very racist. And you are not Mexican. You have to say no I’m not Mexican. My mother is from Colombia that is different to Mexican. From Mexico. But in general, I think they are very adapted to this culture, where it’s their country.
Bay Halloran 30:40
Yeah, yeah, they were born here.
Patty Gray 30:43
Yeah. So they don’t have any accent like me or anything like that. But yeah, I know. I know. And I tell you that I don’t have any problem, and I don’t feel any discrimination or anything, but I hear a lot of discrimination from other people. Because I have different experience.
Bay Halloran 31:07
Exactly.
Patty Gray 31:09
So, and my daughter she said to me I feel discriminated. Yes. And she would laugh about that somebody called her like that. And I say no, it’s not nothing. I don’t like, you see? But-
Bay Halloran 31:25
You didn’t really have that experience.
Patty Gray 31:27
Yeah.
Bay Halloran 31:29
That’s pretty nice. Yeah, I guess it could be really annoying if lumping you with, all people from Latin America as Mexican or something like that.
Patty Gray 31:40
Exactly. It’s like is that is it and maybe I understand that you don’t, you maybe don’t do it in a bad way. But, but you have to be careful because people can get like because you like that you say you are America USA from you like to say you are I don’t know what. You see if I am Colombian I don’t want to call Mexico be called Mexican.
Bay Halloran 32:12
Yeah, Colombia-
Patty Gray 32:14
Mexico is nothing bad, no, but-
Bay Halloran 32:16
No, it’s not it’s not bad. It’s just you’re not Mexican. Colombia is a completely different place from Mexico is a completely different place from Venezuela and stuff like that.
Bay Halloran 32:33
Um
Bay Halloran 32:37
So is there anything you wish people would understand about immigrants better than they do now? Personally, do you think people are more or less on educated on why people come here and what they do or do you think or do you think they’re
Patty Gray 32:54
Yes, I think it is important that you know, everybody doesn’t come for the same reason. I very, very many, many immigrants come plus professional, some older ones, mostly many of them came looking for these, looking for a job and something to eat. This one an opportunity to get, and I want social services, and I tell you these people work very hard. Because you do see there are the people in construction or the people in gardening or the people in all other stuff that is that. And I even have friends that have companies; construction companies and saying, “I need to get Hispanic people because they are the best people to work.” So I mean, I think Hispanic people legal, or illegal, mostly legal, are the base in many in many areas of the economy.
Patty Gray 34:11
Right.
Patty Gray 34:12
And, and you have to respect the job, they worked so hard, and they are in general, these people are very work very hard workers. I spent time with many of them and they are trying to do a better life for the kids.
Bay Halloran 34:31
Especially ’cause um you know, they’ll do the jobs that many Americans don’t want-
Patty Gray 34:39
Want to do it because they are paying delays and they are working so many hours, a lot of hours and very hard jobs.
Bay Halloran 34:48
So does it- sorry go on.
Patty Gray 34:52
Well, I think that if America gave some rules of things they can use that, and don’t be like an enemy, but something that they can use it and provide that food maybe or work to these people that they are asking for that. They just need a job.
Bay Halloran 35:17
Right. That’s, that’s a big reason why people come here.
Patty Gray 35:21
Yeah. Mostly central American, or these people stay because they used to pass a wall and all that and they have to apply for visa on a airplane, but and they work very hard, most of them. They do something like control or something big established, I think they can give a real use value or use some console of the immigration.
Bay Halloran 35:51
Does it does you bother you kind of when, like people will say, you know, just in the media or in general that like immigrants are here coming here and like, stealing American jobs and being lazy, and so?
Patty Gray 36:05
It bothers me a lot.
Bay Halloran 36:06
Yeah.
Patty Gray 36:08
It bothers me, because it’s not true.
Bay Halloran 36:10
it’s not true at all.
Patty Gray 36:12
Is not true at all, because the jobs that they have, in general, are the job that American doesn’t want to have. Because doesn’t want to pay more for good jobs.
Bay Halloran 36:29
Yeah. And another big part, I guess, is that, you know, even though they’re jobs that are seen as like, dirty, or, you know, involves a lot of hard work, they’re still better paying and that what they would have been in their home countries a lot of the time.
Patty Gray 36:45
Oh a lot, a lot pay. Oh, the quality of life improved a lot. And they have something to eat.
Bay Halloran 36:54
Yeah.
Patty Gray 36:55
Even though they are doing the same job.
Bay Halloran 37:00
Yeah, that’s a pretty admirable.
Patty Gray 37:05
Because that’s why they come because the condition in their countries, they are living in very bad conditions really.
Bay Halloran 37:16
And a lot of them come to support their families as well.
Patty Gray 37:21
To support their families.
Bay Halloran 37:27
Well, that was it for most of the questions I had, I guess. I guess we can talk about some of like the legal things that have happened in the recent past revolving on DACA, and stuff like that. What are kind of your opinions on? Like, Trump kind of trying to remove the, remove DACA in general, and then like taking away support from DACA recipients. Who, like, don’t have much time to stay in the country left or stuff like that.
Patty Gray 38:08
Well, I think, I think those kids are really Americans. And I think they deserve to be here, because this is now the country that they know. They study here, most of them I think they have jobs, and they are producing, they are paying taxes. If America start to fill out who is and I think they can control that. Who is producing, who is working. And we know that, I think they have the right to be here. They’re productive people in this country.
Bay Halloran 38:51
Yeah, I think we definitely can differentiate between the people that are you know, maybe maybe the criminals who are you’re just spreading trouble and whatnot, and and the people who are actually working hard and have been here their entire lives?
Patty Gray 39:05
Yeah.
Bay Halloran 39:06
Would you would you say pretty much the same thing about illegal immigrants as well who may have come here illegally, but still work hard and pay taxes within their community? That they should be given the right to stay or do you think differently in that regards?
Patty Gray 39:22
I think immigration has to be a reform. If the people are here is because in some moment they get here and they allow them to be here and work here and all that. But they do a reform and they control more, who is coming here, what is that person doing here? It is people producing these people is paying taxes being a good citizen, all the other stuff. I think they have the right because America is, well I think America is a country that is based in all immigrants, everybody’s an immigrant here. So why will we if there are jobs for these people, why don’t we give them the opportunity for them to have a better life?
Bay Halloran 40:17
Right.
Patty Gray 40:20
I am agree that they have to control who is really working, I am agree with that. But they can do it I think.
Bay Halloran 40:32
Yeah, that’s a good sentiment I think. So yeah is there anything else you would like to add that I haven’t asked you about?
Patty Gray 40:47
No.
Bay Halloran 40:49
Nothing?
Patty Gray 40:50
Nothing.
Bay Halloran 40:51
That’s fine. I’m going to stop the recording now.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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