Interview with Mary Cormier, History 150 Spring 2023, Conducted by Aidan Waterfield, March 23, 2023.
Overview
Mary’s decision to move from Ireland to the United States at the age of 15 was driven by the pursuit of better education, but her journey also reflects the broader experiences of Irish immigrants who came to the U.S. seeking better opportunities. When she first got to the US Mary stayed with her aunt and uncle in Boston, getting a job at a nursing home to support her family back home. Day-to-day life in the U.S. was very different for Mary, as she had access to modern conveniences such as electricity, running water, and buses, and was able to walk to work. Despite missing her family in Ireland, Mary was able to adjust to her new life in the U.S. with the help of the older people she worked with.
Mary’s story reflects the experiences of many Irish immigrants who came to the U.S. in search of better opportunities. The interview offers a glimpse into the challenges faced by immigrants, such as the difficulties of adjusting to a new country and culture, as well as the sacrifices made to support family back home. It also highlights the importance of family connections in making the transition to a new country, as Mary’s aunt and uncle were crucial in helping her settle in the U.S.
The interview provides a unique perspective on immigration in the mid-20th century and complements other interviews on the same topic. Mary’s story also contextualizes the historical importance of immigration and the ways in which it has shaped American society. The interview is situated in a specific time frame, reflecting the experiences of Irish immigrants in the mid-20th century, and underscores the importance of understanding how historical context shapes individual experiences.
Biography
I interviewed my Grandma (Mary Cormier) and talked to her about the immigration process and differences between Ireland and the US. My grandma was born in Kerry Ireland in January of 1946 In a rural town just outside of the city, she grew up with 8 other brothers and sisters and spent her days split between farm work and school. Mary lived in Ireland until she was 15 when she then immigrated to the US in 1961 to live with her aunt and uncle in Boston. She then spent the next year working multiple jobs but one as a nurse’s assistant and working with old people in hospice and sending money back to her family in Ireland. After that year she moved home for a little then spent a year in England trying to make money but couldn’t pay her rent due to the high cost of living England had. She then moved back to the US this time joined by her sister Chris, Mary then worked many different jobs for the next years until meeting my grandfather who was born in Canada, they then settled down and got married and had three kids in a town outside of Boston called Lowell, Two of my aunts still live in New England one in Manchester New Hampshire and one in Chelmsford Mass. Mary now spends her time visiting friends and family and splits her time in Naples Florida, Chelmsford Mass, and Ireland.
Transcript
Aidan: Hello, hello. 0.00
Mary: Hello, Aidan. 0.02
Aidan: Okay, 0.06
Mary: Got it? 0.07
Aidan: So we’re gonna do this all over again. This is the oral history project my history class is doing. We’re trying to, like, learn about people’s past and stuff. Um, one of the first questions I have is what drove you to move to the United States? Like, why did you come here? 0.09
Mary: To better myself, I was the, I had four younger siblings. And the next school that I could go to, I would either have to bicycle or walk and it was seven miles away. 0.28
Aidan: That’s pretty far. 0.31
Mary: Right. And we didn’t have any buses or any cars or transportation. So my aunt and uncle asked me if I’d like to come here to the USA to go to school. And after thinking about it for a while, I said yeah. And then they went to all the work and got my visa and all that stuff. Ready. I was 15 and I came 1.01
Aidan: Woah, and you went to Boston right?
Mary: I came to Boston, yep. They picked me up at Logan Airport and brought me to their house and cooked steaks. And it’s, I went in the house and I sat on the radiator. I didn’t know what a radiator was 1.12
Aidan: Was it hot? A little jumpscare the heat? 1.29
Mary: Yeah. 1.30
Aidan: That’s Funny. Um 1.34
Mary: yeah, go ahead. 1.39
Aidan: Did you come alone? And who did you stay with when you got here, well it was your aunt but
1.42
Mary: I came alone and I stayed with my aunt and uncle they had no children so they asked me to come 1.46
Aidan: that’s nice. 1.55
Mary: Yeah. 1.57
Aidan: How was day to day life in the US different than Ireland. 2.00
Mary: Oh, the day-to-day life here was a big difference. We had buses, electricity, running water and plenty of transportation, nice food. 2.04
Aidan: Yeah. 2.18
Mary: It was a lot easier living Yeah. 2.22
Aidan: Less farm like, More city like 2.27
Mary: yeah, I work I walk to work oh I got a job in a nursing home setting up trays when I was 15 and a half right after I came 2.28
Aidan: make (some) money 2.42
Mary: yeah made $15, ($1.25) there 2.44
Aidan: wow. 2.45
Mary: An hour.
Aidan: It’s a lot different than now.
Mary: Right I sent some home, half of it, to help the younger brothers and sisters 2.54
Mary: (illegible)
Aidan: Come again, what were you gonna say? 3.07
Mary: At Least we had telephones here we had no telephone and Ireland 3.09
Aidan: Could you not call them or anything? Or is
Mary: A telegram that I ran
Aidan: That’s cool.
Aidan: Um, how about family life? How did it differ? Or was it not (so different) 3.26
Mary: I missed all the children from Ireland. But I got adjusted. I’ve worked with older people and they were great to me.
Mary: After a year I went back to Ireland for a visit and I stayed and then I tried England for 10 months seven days a week there and I didn’t have enough money to pay the rent all work no play 3.51
Aidan: that’s annoying, it’s expensive there that’s why 4.05
Mary: Yeah. 4.07
Aidan: Why Massachusetts? Why not anywhere else in the US just because your aunt 4.11
Mary: My Aunt, This is where my aunt lived and I have cousins here also not to far away 4.16
Aidan: the transition was easier because all the family 4.22
Mary: Right 4.23
Aidan: Yeah. 4.24
Mary: I had had family other members cousins up in Haverhill Mass which is right near Lowell Mass. 4.25
Aidan: Oh like a town over. 4.34
Mary: Yeah 4.38
Aidan: That’s nice. 4.40
Aidan: Um, was there anything that imprinted on you from Ireland that you still do today? 4.43
Mary: Uh, Yeah, I like it here a lot better, but Ireland is lovely also, And now they have electricity and cars and they’re flying over there, they’re flying. 4.45
Aidan: Yup 5.03
Mary: And they have everything. 5.04
Aidan: Yeah. 5.10
Mary: But it wasn’t like that back in 1961 it was a poor country now it’s the richest country in the world, I believe. 5.12
Aidan: Dang Yeah. 5.25
Aidan: Looking back on everything, would you change anything? Would you move somewhere else? Would you have stayed? 5.27
Mary: No, I wouldn’t have moved anyplace else. I like it over here. Because there’s plenty of stuff to work with. You can get jobs go to school. And plenty of nice food. The food in Ireland was not great. But we had our own farm. Back in Ireland. I missed the farm a bit. Not the work. 5.34
Aidan: Yeah. there’s a couple farms up in New England. 6.00
Mary: Yeah. 6.03
Aidan: Go see the pigs and horses and stuff. 6.04
Mary: Right. We did all that in Ireland this past month there or this month 6.10
Aidan: Yeah. 6.18
Mary: It was nice, Cold 6.21
Aidan: Climates kind of the same. In New England. Don’t you think? 6.24
Mary: It’s kinda the same, but it’s damp, they’re very damp. 6.30
Aidan: Yeah. It’s a lot more rainy too 6.33
Mary: Yeah, it’s damp year round. Because the buildings the homes are built with cement. 6.37
Aidan: Oh, yeah. So it keeps the condensation. 6.42
Mary: Right. And you should see the installation they’re putting up, like paper towel kind of thing. 6.46
Aidan: Dang, okay, wait (nah) I already asked that question. 6.58
Aidan: Um from the time you came here. What has been the biggest change you’ve seen? like social. 7.01
Mary: Oh social, Yes. Plenty social life here. There’s plenty of social life in Ireland also. We did a lot of socializing when I was young. 7.10
Aidan: Well you had a huge family so that’s a lot, a lot of people socializing. 7.23
Mary: Yeah. And you couldn’t go out and meet boys or girls and whatever you wanted to meet. They you’d have to walk at night. 7.26
Aidan: Yeah. 7.36
Mary: my parents wouldn’t let us. I dont blame them 7.37
Aidan: Yeah. 7.42
Aidan: A Lot more spread out. 7.43
Mary: Right. 7.45
Aidan: Well, that’s all I have with questions. Do you want to add anything? Do you have anything else to like say or, 7.46
Mary: no good luck with it and Ireland is beautiful and USA is beautiful. 7.53
Aidan: Thank you. 7.59
Mary: All right Aidan, and your handsome bye bye 8.01
Aidan: bye 8.06
Research
The 1960s saw a wave of Irish immigrants moving to Boston in search of better economic opportunities. In the 1960s Ireland was facing a struggling economy and high unemployment rates, pushing many to seek work overseas. The United States was a popular destination for Irish immigrants, particularly Boston. In the interview Mary credited the reason for her leaving Ireland was to make more money and have a better opportunity then she would have had staying.
According to a peer-reviewed article by James R. Barrett, the Irish immigration to Boston during the 1960s was largely motivated by economic reasons. The author notes that while the overall rate of immigration to the United States had decreased since the 1920s, the number of Irish immigrants increased during the 1960s due to the economic stagnation in Ireland. When Mary moved to the US she very easily could find a job which she said during the interview was not easy to do back in Ireland and the jobs that were offered were often labor intensive such as farm work which didn’t suit her well.
In the Journal “Irish Immigrants and Their Jobs in 1960s America” by Timothy J. Meagher discusses Irish immigrants working in hospitals in entry-level positions such as nursing aides and janitorial staff. Mary talked about how one of the first jobs she got when coming to the states was a Nurses Assistant and how that was paying her well compared to what she was earning in Ireland. Another thing Mary emphasized was family and how important having family and helping her family was. In the article “Large families in Boston” the author talks about the cultural norm of Irish people having large catholic families and being close with their family members. Mary stressed the importance of family by talking about how she sent much of her money home to help her family as well as the importance of staying near family and in touch with them, like living with her aunt and uncle and telegramming her family overseas.
Bibliography
Barrett, James R. “The Irish in Boston in the 1960s: Issues and Images.” Journal of American Ethnic History, vol. 6, no. 1, 1986, pp. 47-62.
Meagher, Timothy J. “Irish Immigrants and Their Jobs in 1960s America.” Journal of American Ethnic History, vol. 14, no. 3, 1995, pp. 21-46.
“Large Irish Families of Boston.” Irish Boston, https://irishboston.org/large-irish-families/.
Follow-Up Commentary
The interviewee, Mary Cormier, approved the transcript on April 1, 2023. No changes were requested.
Interview Technology and Process
This interview was recorded over Zoom, because Mary lives in Chelmsford, MA and I am in Harrisonburg, VA. The meeting was recorded and the audio file was converted and saved as an mp3 file. I used Otter.ai to transcribe the interview, then edited the transcript manually.