Jörg Lueker Interview, History 150 Spring 2017, Conducted by Carly Cashman, March 9, 2017.
- a. This was a phone interview, that went easily. I did not edit any of it however, there is some unnecessary sections that were labeled to skip over. In order for this interview to be recorded on Google Voice I had to download the app and learn how to actually use it. Setting up the interview was not difficult as it was with my uncle and I did it while no one was home so I had no background noise. Also, my uncle went to a quiet room so we could hear each other and there were no distractions.
- b. Jörg Lueker, my great uncle, was born in Hamburg, Germany on September 22, 1941 into a socialist family. Jörg was the second of the two children. Growing up with his sister and single mom because his father was taken by Nazi’s. Being part of a socialist family there was not a lot of opportunity for choice and you were stuck in the area. He at the age of 20 years old moved to the states in the 1961 looking for a better life. He moved there where he would live with his sister, who was already in the United States with her husband. Thankfully, his sister was there to help him get himself all together and do well as that was all the family he had in the U.S. Jörg was a very hard worker and never backed down to his challenges. This characteristic is why every obstacle he had to overcome he kept his head up because this was the better life he wanted to live and choose how he was going to live it.
- c. Germany during this time was just a different lifestyle than what the United States was. In the later 20th century, Germany was reconstructing from what had fallen post World War II and then two years after the Cold War had begun. During this period, the Berlin Wall was built. Also, living there their class system and living was very structured and you could not really go around it. There were multiple stages where the middle class were a lot of Nazi supporters and then there were the lower class and upper class. The class structure was very clear-cut standing (Germany). Many people were unhappy with the economic struggles during this time and the rising levels of discontent and the government lacking the capacity to satisfy consumer demand, this specifically angered the socialists (Thomson). Many Germans during this time could no longer deal with the inability to determine their future and constantly being surrounded by the craziness of something always going on or stirring up around them. The tension was always building up and the only way to escape it was to leave Germany and many already had families over in the Unites states. The biggest boom of emigrates into the Unites States from Germany was during World War 1 so it was always a common option since then (German).
Class in German History. (2012). German History, 30(3), 429-451.
German – A New Surge of Growth – Immigration…- Classroom Presentation | Teacher Resources – Library of Congress. (n.d.). Retrieved March 24, 2017, from https://www.loc.gov/teachers/classroommaterials/presentationsandactivities/presentations/immigration/german4.html
Germany. (n.d.). Retrieved March 23, 2017, from http://www.everyculture.com/Ge-It/Germany.html
Thomson, H. (2017). Repression, Redistribution and the Problem of Authoritarian Control: Responses to the 17 June Uprising in Socialist East Germany.
East European Politics & Societies, 31(1), 68-92. doi:10.1177/0888325416670241
Interviewee: Jörg Lueker (Jörg); Interviewer: Carly Cashman (CC)
d. Transcript:
Start at 0:15
CC: How old were you when you left Germany?
Jörg: 20 years old.
CC: What was your main reasoning for leaving Germany?
Jörg: Just to adventure and get to know the United States.
… (Skip to 0:40)
CC: What was the process of coming to America like?
Jörg: I had to go to the Unites States consulate in Hamburg and I had to ask for application and then I had to meet the requirements and filled out the applications and brought them back to the embassy and then they looked it over and I had to sign a bunch of papers in order to get a green card. In order to get a green card because I was of age to serve in the Unites States Army I had to sign a paper say I would serve and it also said that I cannot refuse to serve. After I signed it I was told I would have to wait to see if I was admitted and I got the permit to immigrate to the United States about 2 months later.
CC: What were your feelings like during this process and leaving Germany?
Jörg: I was young and I had no feelings bad or good, I was just looking forward to getting over there.
CC: When you go to the United States were there any barriers you had to overcome or obstacles like a language barrier?
Jörg: No, one of the requirements was to know a basic knowledge of the English language before I could leave Germany so I could support myself. I also needed to have enough income to support myself for one year and I had to have a job to prove to them for the when I arrived in the US. They wanted to ensure I could support myself so they did not have to deal with me and made sure I was self-sufficient.
CC: What was your job when you arrived in the United States?
Jörg: I was hired as a handy man in the hospital and I also worked in two apartments houses with a total of 23 family and I would bring out the trash and clean stairs and help tenants with needs. Naturally, at a young age you didn’t want to do that work but it was necessary and I had to do it.
CC: Was your adjustment to the states hard or difficult at all?
Jörg: No, you just had to what it takes to survive and that takes work. I worked like I said in the hospital and in the super. It was all part of getting along.
CC: Was there anything specific you missed from Germany when you came to the states?
Jörg: No, I didn’t expect anything special and I wanted to get to know here. Which I did, when I got here I did a lot of traveling like when I got here I traveled the subway with 15 cents and traveled each way, it was very fun.
CC: What cultural traditions did you bring with you?
Jörg: I didn’t bring anything with me but some clothing and things like dishes for my family that I brought over. I was headed to my sister who lived here and was also my sponsor.
CC: What did your sponsor have to do for you?
Jörg: Nothing, they had to write me a letter saying they would be responsible for me if I got into trouble or could not find any work, it was just a requirement to get here.
CC: Did you ever have to serve time in the United States Army because you signed that paper before arriving here?
Jörg: Well yes, since I volunteered I had to within 6 months of arriving in the US, I had to register with the selective service system in NYC. I had to then go through exams to see if I was able to serve and I requested a delay twice and on Dec 24, 1963 I got my draft notice to report to White Hall St. on January 6, 1964 for the induction into the US Army. And my draft notice had a 15 cents token glued to it so I had the means to get to White Hall Street and I had no excuse to not making it there. From there, we got transported to Newark, NJ and then we were flown to Ft Pope, Louisiana and from there I was there for 3 months. Reason for it was because of the US in a build up because of the Cuban Missile Crisis and we had to rehabilitate the barracks there and then I went to Ft Sill, Oklahoma for another 2 months, then I was sent to Korea for 13 months. After those 13 months, I was in Oklahoma for another 6 then I was discharged on January 7th, 1966.
CC: Wow.
Jörg: That was quite a good experience, didn’t hurt, it was good.
CC: Was there any barriers or a different experience because you were from Germany and serving in the US?
Jörg: NO, the only funny thing in Ft. Sill we had 240 guys in one battery that learned how to shoot a 105 Howitzer and out of 240 we had 180 were Germans and 60 Americans. The 180 Americans were sent to Germany and the Germans were sent to Korea. I learned how the US Army worked. But anyways, I went to Korea and I have seen a lot of Japan on the way over we saw Anchorage Alaska 6 days after the earthquake in ‘64. I also spent a lot of time in Tokyo which was actually Yokohama because they lost my records so I had a lot of time sight-seeing. On the way back, we came back by ship because that was their policy, you fly over and come back on a ship so I was a lucky passenger on the U.S.S Mitchell, a troop carrier. We had quite a ride because we hit a hurricane. After my service, I went back to work.
CC: Back to work at the hospital?
Jörg: Yes, however I didn’t stay long because I got cheated and I didn’t take anything that I didn’t like and I got a new job at a different hospital in Brooklyn downtown and worked there for longer than 35 years. But, I did very well. I could buy a house, support my family, naturally with that goes with the cars and whatever else was needed.
CC: Very nice. So, how long did you have to have your sister be your sponsor? Or does that end when you become a citizen?
Jörg: Yeah when I was in Korea I thought I could become a citizen by being in Korea for 6 months but I found out there were no exceptions I had to be in the US for 5 years and then I could apply for citizenship. Which is what I did, when I came out of service I applied for citizenship and I had to go to the Supreme Court in Brooklyn downtown where I was interviewed, asked questions about American history. They would try to give trick questions, they wanted to see if I could speak and understand English. A lot of what I went through however, has been done away with and it is a shame. After I passed everything, we were put into a big hall to be asked by the judge if I wanted to change my name and he said okay it’s your problem not mine. After that, the judge then sworn me in and I became a U.S Citizen.
CC: So, how long was the learning process or did you just have to be living here for five years or what were the other credentials to become a citizen?
Jörg: I was here for five years, then I was honorably discharged by the army, and they checked all of my background before I got asked to come back to get sworn in.
…(Skip to 15:05)
CC: What were some of the biggest differences in the United States compared to Germany?
Jörg: Well, I grew up as a socialist and our area was a blue color area where I grew up. Meaning, I needed to really jump through a hoop to get out of that area. Growing up a socialist doesn’t help and I wanted to get out from under and I had a idea to immigrate with my friend to Sweden but that didn’t work out for me because I went to the United States and he went up to Stockholm. Once, I got to the U.S I decided to stay. In the U.S, you had a choice in what you wanted to do and wherever you wanted to work. But to get anywhere you just had to work. I went over to the U.S with zero dollars and now I have been retired for 15 years with a nice retirement plan in which I worked to have.
CC: What did you miss most about Germany, if you missed anything?
Jörg: The culture, it’s just a different culture. Europe was developed earlier than the United States so their old buildings and villages are quite nice and homey. It is not the same here in the U.S as I have put foot in about 42 of the 50 states. So because it was developed from nothing and it is just new and different.
CC: Gotcha, okay well, thank you for letting me interview you and thank you for your time.
Jörg: Of course, you’re welcome.
Conclusion: I thought my interview went well. My uncle sometimes wouldn’t answer the question how I had expected and he would kind of jump around so I felt that some of my questions could have been in a better order to stay on track. I think if I was able to do this interview again, I would want to meet up with my uncle rather than over the phone. I felt it would have just been a better experience to actually be face to face. However, other than that I thought it went well and I got a very good perspective and story of the lifestyle immigrants had to live and their processes. I think this was a very rewarding experience and it is cool to learn about others’ lives as I was born here and would never have to go through that process and did not realize how fortunate I am.